“SOAKING”: Biblical OR Mysticism?
“SOAKING” IS SIN. There no such thing as “soaking” in God’s Word as it’s defined today by the witchcraft NAR (New Apostolic Reformation) cult!
For starters, is not coming from God, is not in His Word and is a lazy person’s delusion.
There’s no such thing as “soaking” in the Bible. It’s time to repent, to deny self, to take up the cross and follow Jesus for real and stop trying to get a fix, a feeling, a shortcut.
FLASHPOINT: The LORD told us that He manifests Himself to those who deny self, take up the cross, and walk with Him (Luke 9:23-24; John 14:21-23, etc.). He doesn’t manifest His holy presence to disobedience lazy dupes who sit around “soaking.” Total scam. Run for your life. New age occult practice!
Yes God inhabits the praises of His people and Jesus also tells us that He and the Father specifically manifest Themselves to those who abide, who worship and obey Them – and not those who sit around “soaking” in a presence they claim is from above yet is suspect of being from below (Psalms 22:3; John 14:21-23).
ARE you seeking to experience God OR to KNOW HIM? (John 17:3)
“People want a word from God instead of the Word OF God.” Warren Smith
Lots of disobedient, fruit-less, do-nothing counterfeits “soaking” in demons. They will do and seek after ANY and EVERYTHING except the simple obedience the LORD calls them to. They will do anything except lay down their lives and humbly, practically, daily walk with Jesus – worshiping, loving, and serving Him and others (Matthew 22:37-40; Luke 9:23-24). “IN WORKS THEY DENY HIM” – “They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.” (Titus 1:16)
WHAT IS “SOAKING”? “Soaking” is found nowhere in the Bible and is the invention of devils and only participated in by the wicked who have a mere “form of godliness” yet deny the power, the authority of Christ to reign in their daily life… and so are looking for some way to cheat the system, to evade, to deny the cross – the crucified life (2 Timothy 3:1-7; Luke 9:23-24, etc.). The only people who want to “soak” are the unrepentant, disobedient rebels who are not literally obeying God. Jesus and His holy apostles never told anyone to go “soak.” Counterfeits who “soak” seek and believe that God is manifesting His presence to them no different than the yoga cultist who make their little poses, believing that some spirit is going to manifest to them. And, it’s the devil himself manifesting to them and possessing them. Read 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12. Where’s there’s a refusal of truth, there’s a vacuum and demon spirits invade those rebels. “Soaking” is for disobedient rebels who refuse to engage in a practical, daily, cross relationship with Christ. Therefore they never seek God in sober prayer or do the slightest evangelism. “Soaking” is Satan’s accommodation for the wicked, the “reprobate.” (Titus 1:16)
God doesn’t fill or bestow His divine blessing and anointing on lazy, unrepentant, Christ-denying wicked counterfeits who sit and lay around waiting for Him to do so. Delusional.
Here’s how God manifests His approval and presence upon individual men – “He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. … Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? 23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.” (John 14:21, 23) And yes, we’re going to drill this passage – these words from the Son of God!
In word or concept “soaking” is found nowhere in Scripture. The LORD Jesus calls those who will be His to lay down their lives in this fleeting world and humbly, simply, quietly serve Him and others (Matthew 20:24-28; 22:37-40; 23:8-12; Philippians 2:3-5, etc.).
The same frauds who participate in this soaking witchcraft do not have the fruit of love in their lives (Galatians 5:22-23). They won’t go next door to ask their neighbor if they need prayer for anything and yet they will travel half way around the world to “soak” with a bunch of delusional flakes.
“Soaking” is many times coupled with the “holy laughter” or “drunk in the spirit” so-called “revivals that we see in apostate churches yet nowhere in God’s Word. But the LORD warns us to:
“Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:” 1 Peter 5:8
Satan is devouring those who do not know and obey God’s Word.
“My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.” Hosea 4:6
Instead of reading God’s Word daily and living it out for themselves, they’ve relegated their eternal souls into the care of devouring wolves (Matthew 7:15). Those who follow this false movement and it’s fraudulent wolves, are enticed to buy into this notion that God’s presence is going to do what they refuse to do, like obey Him. Not.
“Sow to yourselves in righteousness, reap in mercy; break up your fallow ground: for it is time to seek the LORD, till he come and rain righteousness upon you.” Hosea 10:12
The NAR (New Apostolic Reformation) cult loves to say this: “His presence is changing lives.” Read John 15:1-16 for the biblical truth about a daily, abiding relationship with Christ and the corresponding fruit. When we see people saying God’s presence transforms life it entices the biblically illiterate to simply try to go “soak” and get some magic transformation of their character. This is why those in this false movement have a mere “form of godliness” because they “deny the power” (authority) of God by submitting to His cross and are “Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.” (2 Timothy 3:7) Repentance and the central cross message of the original Gospel is never taught in this heretical system.
“I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. 2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.” Romans 12:1-2
According to Romans 12:1-2, transformation, change, the production of the fruit of the Spirit requires presenting our bodies a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to the LORD, that is the crucified life, which is never taught among the false prophets of the NAR cult.
“Therefore also now, saith the LORD, turn ye even to me with all your heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning: 13 And rend your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto the LORD your God: for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and repenteth him of the evil. 14 Who knoweth if he will return and repent, and leave a blessing behind him; even a meat offering and a drink offering unto the LORD your God? 15 Blow the trumpet in Zion, sanctify a fast, call a solemn assembly:” Joel 2:12-15
Acting a fool has no place among true Christians.
Those who refuse to humbly, literally obey God – on his stated terms, will consciously soak in the flames of eternal damnation as hell is cast into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:11-15). REPENTANCE AND FRUIT TO PROVE IT IS A MUST (Matthew 3:7-10; Luke 13:3).
“That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ.” Ephesians 4:14-15
The more I look at these things, the more it seems that these people are infiltrating warlocks and witches (Psalms 74).
What is now called “soaking” is the experience whereby people gather to sort of marinate before the LORD. Like the so-called “revivals” of the 1990’s, they will lay and seek to conjure up the presence of God which is an experience foreign to the biblical revelation revealed in the 27 book canon of the New Testament. There were prayer meetings in the NT for specific purposes, but never a soak till we get something meeting (Acts 12). While “soaking” like this they think they are being filled or saturated with the LORD’s presence, yet there are some strange things associated with this type activity as we saw in the false revivals of the recent past. What is now being called “soaking” is simply a repackaging and re-entry of the strange fire experiences we saw in the Toronto and Brownsville “revivals” which did not align with what we see in the Word, so are to be exposed as such.
“Marinating” or “soaking” takes the emphasis off of JESUS and puts in on the deceived dupe which makes it antichrist (in place of Christ). This means that those perpetrating this filthy robbery of the glory of Jesus are antichrists (Colossians 2).
“Why is it that ‘Christians’ keep coming up with things to dramatize Christianity and make it all about them. We have direct access in prayer to God through Jesus. There is absolutely no closer relationship than that soaking does nothing but get you wet. Sad and pathetic.” Paula M.
SOAK THIS!!!!!
It’s high time to repent, come out from among these devils and “soak” our darkened, deceived, apostate hearts and mind in God’s Word and go speak it to the precious lost soul for whom Jesus bled on that cross. We need some serious “washing of water by the word.” (Ephesians 5:25-27) …… Read Ezekiel 3:1-4 …. The LORD told His servant Ezekiel, and is telling you and I, to soak our minds and hearts in His blessed written Word and then GO tell somebody! Anybody ever heard of something called Christ’s GREAT COMMISSION?! It’s pretty simple. What excuse will we have on that Day!? It’s time to get a clue saints, we’ve been hoodwinked! Pass this on if you dare take such a stand … Jesus is coming …. What’s there to lose but eternal souls for whom Christ died and rose again? You don’t think any of the modern wolf “pastors” cares do you? No, they could care less because they are too busy denying Christ while they build their own empire – church business, marketing their communities for more nickels, noses, and numbers. Are you helping them blaspheme Christ? If so, you will receive the same eternal judgment as they do (2 John 7-11).
It’s one gimmick after another, one post card promising to entertain them and their children better than ABC church down the street. They are drawing unsuspecting, undiscerning sheep into their wolf dens that they call “church.”
If we don’t repent, the only soaking we’re going to be doing is when the LORD immerses us in the LAKE of fire! (Revelation 20:11-15)
The following should give some insight into the origins of this experienced-based (not truth-based) movement that we now see. Here is an excerpt taken from an article entitled What is really going on in the church?: http://www.letusreason.org/Pent25.htm
- “It was Benny Hinn who inaugurated Rodney Browne into ministry at one of his meetings in the early 90’s; from there he went to Hagin and then Copeland’s church, then TBN and the rest is history.
Browne says this much chaos must be from the Holy Ghost. This is clearly double-talk. The Holy Ghost of the Bible does not create chaos, He turns chaos into order. Browne describes the spirit he calls holy as a force like electricity running out of his fingers bouncing off and deflecting to others. Is this describing the Holy Ghost of the Scripture or a power that is running amok in their services. He’s got everyone under his spell of laughter thinking that anything that goes on at these meetings even if they are clearly unbiblical is of the Holy Ghost. This is the new order of another spirit and not the Holy Spirit of God. He (Rodney Howard Browne) states : “I’d rather be in a church where the devil and the flesh are manifesting than in a church where nothing is happening because people are too afraid to manifest anything… and if a devil manifests, don’t worry about that either. Rejoice because at least something is happening.” One could write several volumes chronicling the errors in the above statement. A revival of the Spirit does not manifest the flesh. God says clearly that if one walks in the Spirit, that he will not fulfill the desires of the flesh. (Gal. 5:1 6). These are contrary to each other. The works of the flesh will never compliment the workings of the Spirit. If the devil and the flesh are manifesting in a meeting, I would hope that it was an exorcism and the devil would be leaving rather than staying and participating! Jesus came to destroy the works of the devil, not to put him on display.”
Did you catch this? Rodney Howard Browne states: “I’d rather be in a church where the devil and the flesh are manifesting than in a church where nothing is happening because people are too afraid to manifest anything… and if a devil manifests, don’t worry about that either. Rejoice because at least something is happening.” Is there any doubt that Browne here invited and brought in demons to the body of Christ? Woe to those gatekeepers (shepherds, pastors) who allowed this abomination and used the name of the LORD in vain by attaching His holy name to this wickedness!
Is there any remotely similar experience seen in Holy Scripture as today’s new “soaking” movement and experience? Or, is this yet another fad movement spawned from so-called “revivals” of the not-too-distant past? Is this “soaking” phenomenon another of the latest “winds of doctrine” blowing through the modern church world? Should such be weighed in the balance against Holy Scripture to see if it is of God OR just blindly received?
“The simple (naïve; undiscerning) believeth every word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going.” Proverbs 14:15
“Prove (test) all things; hold fast that which is good.” 1 Thessalonians 5:21
“Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.” 1 John 4:1
In God’s economy, being gullible is a curse and not a virtue. Being a nice little, easy-going and agreeable Christian is not the goal of Christ for His disciples and is completely inconsistent with the lives of the apostles and early church.
It is incumbent upon the last day saints of the LORD to look very closely at new fad experiences and doctrines blowing through the church world, especially in light of the predecessor “revivals” of the 1990’s, where men and women rolled around on the floor barking and roaring like animals. For this writer such activities are not hearsay – I was there. These “revivals” we know bore not the fruit of a true biblical revival.
How naïve shall we be? Shall we again buy into that which has no connection to biblical Christianity?
The following 3 points on Gnosticism are taken from http://www.crossroad.to/Q&A/church/postmodern/soaking.htm
And yes, incorporates three key tenets of Gnosticism:
- 1. Faith and knowledge based primarily on personal or mystical experience rather than the Word.
- 2. Emphasis on self-knowledge and emotional well-being or healing, rather than biblical knowledge of God and His freedom through the cross and cleansing through His blood (already accomplished).
- 3. Illogical and feeling-based interpretations of His Word.
George Parker writes:
“I have witnessed two prayer soaks, and each time my spiritual antenna began to blink. I believe that all it is, is a form of New Age mysticism, that has come about by the New Age gospel that has infiltrated the body of Christ since Eugene Peterson’s perverted and watered down version of God’s inspired Word, which is nothing more than a New Age perversion. And Rick Warren’s New Age gospel of having a purpose-driven life.”
“How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.” Isaiah 14:12-15
Self-exaltation forever severed Satan from the Almighty. This movement seems to follow the pomp philosophy of Lucifer while cloaking itself as a Christian experience, yet with no biblical grounds.
At the heart of the divine economy is the worship of God and elevating of others above self (Matt. 22:37-39).
To show just how widespread this “soaking” phenomenon is becoming, here below is an excerpt from John Arnott, pastor of the Airport Vineyard in Toronto where the laughing revival started in the 1990’s. During this “Toronto Blessing” movement, people roared and did many strange animalistic things under the circus leaders of this movement who had no Scripture to justify such weird and unusual, unnatural manifestations.
“Soaking” is not Scriptural and it’s Pure Selfishness
“Overcome in Your presence” and language like this flood the music and messages of the modern church world. And, so, we have a generation of “prophetic” counterfeits who are waiting around for God to do something. He won’t because they ask “amiss” or with the wrong motive, while in disobedience to what He already stated in His Word, the “MORE sure word of prophecy.” (2 Peter 1:16-21)
“Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not. 3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.” James 4:2-3
“He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law (Word; instructions), even his prayer shall be abomination.” Proverbs 28:9
“Shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” James 2:18
Jesus tells us how God works and it’s on record in John 14:21, 23. He and the Father abide with and manifest themselves to those who obey Him… not those who have a mere form of godliness as they seek the LORD to come upon them in a special way while they are not obeying Him. Counterfeits.
“He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him … 23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.” John 14:21,23
Only those who follow Christ’s teachings prove that they know and follow Christ and it’s to these true disciples that God makes Himself manifest (Matthew 7:21; John 8:47, etc.).
John Arnott:
“Let’s get back to supernatural church” by John Arnott
- · “…we hear the term, ‘church without walls’ but what does this mean? While it can mean sending teams from a local church outside the church’s walls to minister in homes and in the marketplace, I believe it is much more than that. If we are going to reach this world for Jesus, we need a completely new model of doing church …
- · “I believe the vision God gave us here in Toronto for Soaking Prayer Centers all over the world is a great response to the Great Commission. In just over one year, we have had over 4,000 people order our ‘Soaking Kit‘ and begin a small group of ‘called out ones’ in their homes….
- · “Why the interest? Because it is a quick, simple way to get involved into the supernatural ministry of Jesus and start helping people receive healing, deliverance and freedom, to come into the joy of the Lord and be filled with the Spirit. The Soaking Kit includes all the basic information you need to start your own ‘soaking center’ in your home or business.”
Much could be said about these words of Mr. Arnott. Notice these words from Arnott concerning “soaking”: “Because it is a quick, simple way to get involved into the supernatural ministry of Jesus and start helping people receive healing, deliverance and freedom, to come into the joy of the Lord and be filled with the Spirit.” Sound smooth? Sound biblical? Since when is walking with Christ and doing ministry “quick”? Is there a “quick, simple way to get involved into the supernatural ministry”? Is “soaking” a “supernatural ministry” of the Holy Spirit or “another spirit”? (2 Cor. 11:4) This is the false premise for this whole “soaking” movement – a “quick, simple way” to get around a true walk with God which requires Jesus increasing and we decreasing – the crucifixion of the fleshly nature with fastings, prayer, repentance and obedience (2 Chronicles 7:14).
In Psalm 51 we see a divine sequence: first purging, then filling, and then ministry. Real ministry is not a “quick” fix, but rather a relationally-based preparation that requires that the believer humble himself under the mighty hand of God for purging and cleansing that he might be “a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master’s use, and prepared unto every good work.”
“Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master’s use, and prepared unto every good work.” 2 Timothy 2:19-21
Tell-Tale Fruit
“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.” Galatians 5:22-23
From personal experience in this 1990s “blessing” movement (and study of it), this writer has concluded that there was very little fruit of the Holy Spirit produced in those supposed “revivals.” The fruit of the supposed “revivals” of the 1990’s was not “love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness…” If such is true, do we conclude that it was a blessing or a curse? When God really moves (revival), there will be deep repentance, total trust, praise, Holy Ghost filling, water baptism, doctrinal purity, and a deep hunger for the Word! Read Acts.
“God is love” and those who truly know Him serve Him according to His Word which includes lifting up others above self (rather than self-seeking). See 1 John.
Where is the love? Are these revivals producing true Christian, Christ-like love, where people lay down their lives for their LORD and the brethren? This “soaking” phenomenon is to be weighed no differently than when we are in our local gatherings and sing, clap, dance and shout to the LORD in praise and yet never reach out with Christian love to commune with and bless the brethren of the LORD. Such deficiency of Christ-like love clearly reveals an empty outward religious exercise void of the true substance of worship. In the 1990s and today, the same people who lay on the floor for hours “soaking” seem to get up without exhibiting greater fruit or evidence of the Holy Ghost. Where is the love that is always characterized by loving one’s neighbor? No, instead it seems to be just another selfish experience where people come to get blessed instead of being one, just like the rich woman who lives to be pampered by others giving her massages, pedicures and facials. Those involved in these fad modern church and self-seeking “revivals” still seem to lack the love, real joy, and peace always consistent with the work of the Spirit of God. Such fruit will only come to those who sincerely worship from the depths of their hearts and are doers of the Word and not those who are sitting around doing little or nothing and waiting to be further pampered and fattened by “soaking”.
Do you really want to know how to judge or test this movement or any movement for its authenticity or lack thereof? Jesus commanded: “And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.” (Mark 16:15) The LORD also said “Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.” Matthew 4:19 The book of Proverbs says “He that winneth souls is wise.” (Prov. 11:30) True revival brings repentance and preaching of the Good News – the Gospel – from all truly touched by the LORD. Any other fruit other than that shown in Holy Scripture reveals that a so-called move of God is not biblical, and points to deception and not true revival. Read these following words of Jesus carefully:
“As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father’s commandments, and abide in his love. These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full. This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you. Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you. Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you. These things I command you, that ye love one another.” John 15:9-17
Obedience to the LORD Jesus and His Word in the laying down of one’s life and preferring others above oneself is the fruit of true revival. Anything short of this clearly reveals a false revival.
Who truly loves Jesus? Want to let Jesus answer this question?
“He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him…Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.” John 14:21, 23
According to Jesus, those who follow and obey Him are blessed with His presence. The presence of the LORD is in and with those who are following Him and therefore in motion expanding His kingdom – doing His bidding, not their own (self-seeking).
Cindy Rose Hatfield writes: “(John 16:23-24 KJV ). These verses and others clearly portray prayer as being comprehensible communication with God, not an esoteric, mystical meditation…Nor soaking in music or anything ..It is all in the Word and nowhere is it found to do the above as described…Amen.”
“Charity…Seeketh not Her Own”
“Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. Charity never faileth…” 1 Corinthians 13:4-8
Doers or Deceivers?
“But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.” James 1:22
Abiding in His Love:
“As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father’s commandments, and abide in his love. These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full. This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.” John 15:9-14
The LORD is looking for those who will abide in relationship with Him and obey His Word from a sincere heart of worship. Beloved, bringing your pillow to church to lay on the floor and “soak” is a farce and a fable at best. This is not what the church needs – more coddling while doing little or nothing to obey Jesus. The true church is being called to fasting, prayer, seeking His holy face and obedience to the Word of God and not to be further pampered and fattened, and deluded with more strange fire experiences brought into the church world by the promised false prophets of the last hour (Matt. 24:4-4,11,24; 1 Tim. 4:1-6; 2 Tim. 3:7; 2 Pet. 2-2; Jude 3-4, etc.).
Remember what Christ told us about the believers at Laodicea?
“And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked.” Revelation 3:14-17
Does the already overfed, overweight, do-nothing western world church need even more spoiling? This may sound harsh on the surface, yet I think the question has merit, all things given. Do you?
Have you noticed the pleasure-seeking craze and emphasis of the last few years which is usually cloaked behind some spiritual veneer? Paralleled with the advent of the day spa explosion across the western world, the indulgence and excess of those in the church world has come of age as foretold by the apostles of our LORD – “This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud…heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.” (2 Tim. 3:1-7)
It seems that today people will do anything but what Jesus told us to do and find “biblical” justification for it. But God sees the heart motives and intents of men and will bring these things to the light on that Great and Terrible Day of Judgment.
Concerning soaking, George Parker wrote us and says:
“… prayer soaking and they use all sorts of Scriptures, but I believe that all they are doing is what writers call ‘proof texting’, using Scripture to back up unproven truth. Now if ‘Prayer Soaking’ is Scriptural, then how come it has take over a thousand years to become a force?”
How do you think the people of the world who do not know the LORD view those in the church world who are engrossed in seeking continual self-indulgence, treatment and excess?
The question must be asked: Why would the LORD further pamper people who are not being obedient and fruitful in His harvest as it is? Are we not a bunch of spiritual weaklings?
“If thou hast run with the footmen, and they have wearied thee, then how canst thou contend with horses? and if in the land of peace, wherein thou trustedst, they wearied thee, then how wilt thou do in the swelling of Jordan?” Jeremiah 12:5
While some misled Americans, claiming to be serving the LORD, seek to further pamper their poor little hurting buttocks (due to sitting too much), a large number of true believers in Christ across the world live in danger of martyrdom every day for their faith.
“GO YE”
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.” Mark 16:15
“Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word.” Acts 8:4
Don’t stand around soaking, “go and tell others” is the message of the New Testament.
Those who are authentically touched by the LORD are to be His ambassadors to advance His eternal coming kingdom and not be preoccupied with pampering themselves. The Gospel is moving and those who possess and are possessed by it are “on the go.” Those moved by the LORD from Heaven do exploits among the lost people of their world and the LORD gives His presence to bless and empower them. They don’t congregate to “soak” in more self-seeking, self-indulgent, and self-serving experiences.
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. …And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God. And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.” Mark 16:15, 17-20
The LORD who alone saves, has called all who believe to “Go ye into all the world and preach the gospel.” Because they are “on the go” in obedience to Him, the LORD says here that He will be “confirming the word with signs following.” Jesus is not going to confirm or bless laziness and self-indulgence with His presence or “signs.”
2 Thessalonians 2 says there are “LYING signs and wonders” also just as the two magicians who challenged Moses. And yet there is the authentic which is also coinciding with the root and fruit of those preaching the pure, original Gospel – fruit / doctrine. Read Mark Martin16:15-20 and note that Jesus confirmed the preached WORD with signs and wonders which is telling. He doesn’t confirm foolishness and witchcraft and rolling on the ground, etc., but rather the declaration of His Word.
“I Told You”
“For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. Behold, I have told you before.” Matthew 24:24-25
While we pamper ourselves even more, we further lessen our chances of overcoming when the coming persecution hits within our borders. We have seen nothing yet. God help us in this hour to fast, pray and be broken while the light is still with us. Jesus warned “Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you.” (John 12:35)
Trevor Gamble notes: “This reminds me suddenly of a Christian friend I knew living locally here to me who when I challenged her on believing this kind of stuff unfriended me. She had been trying to talk me into going to Holy Ghost parties. Where she said all roll around laughing hysterically and so much so no one can praise God. I asked her why God should want to stop people praising Him? She tried to claim it was all of God and said some there had experienced seeing gold teeth materializing into the mouths of people. I said God does not go around putting gold teeth in the mouths of believers. Nowhere in scripture does this happen.”
The persecutions that lie just ahead in this nation will be devastating to those who aren’t being prepared in this hour by exercising the Word – doing it. These who have bought into this latest of “strange fire” experiences, are being further blinded and deluded (Leviticus 10:1-2).
“He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.” Revelation 3:5-6
“They Have Cast Fire into Thy Sanctuary”
“Remember thy congregation, which thou hast purchased of old; the rod of thine inheritance, which thou hast redeemed; this mount Zion, wherein thou hast dwelt. Lift up thy feet unto the perpetual desolations; even all that the enemy hath done wickedly in the sanctuary. Thine enemies roar in the midst of thy congregations; they set up their ensigns for signs…They have cast fire into thy sanctuary, they have defiled by casting down the dwelling place of thy name to the ground.” Psalms 74:2-4,7
Leviticus 10 issues forth the severe warning against false prophets who bring “strange fire”among the people of God. The false prophets came under divine judgment and were killed.
“And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, took either of them his censer, and put fire therein, and put incense thereon, and offered strange fire before the LORD, which he commanded them not. And there went out fire from the LORD, and devoured them, and they died before the LORD. Then Moses said unto Aaron, This is it that the LORD spake, saying, I will be sanctified in them that come nigh me, and before all the people I will be glorified.” Leviticus 10:1-3
In my estimation, this “soaking” movement/experience is yet another ridiculous scheme of the enemy to further embalm God’s people and keep them in bondage to self-serving experiences instead of the true worship of the LORD which leads one to love God supremely, deny self, take up the cross, and elevate others above self in truly following Christ. The sad thing is that so many today who are empty after walking through several supposed “revivals,” still go on blindly into yet another fad movement which has literally no biblical reconciliation. This movement will again leave them empty and vulnerable to the next delusion.
Think about it: Isn’t it easier to “soak” than to serve? Isn’t laying around doing “floor time” (their wording) the easy way out? Are these people not being led to follow the line of least resistance by vainly believing one is marinating in the presence of God while “soaking”? Is this in lieu of doing what the LORD told us to do in His Word?
How naïve shall we continue to be? How long will we be led around with the enemy’s hand by the nose and think we are being led by the Holy Spirit? How long shall we take the LORD’s name in vain by labeling false movements like this as from Him? How long shall we refuse to judge and test everything against the Word? How long shall we be “tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive”? (Eph. 4:14)
Did the LORD ever instruct anyone in Scripture to marinate or “soak”? Or, did He instruct His people to mortify the selfish desires of the sinful nature? See Romans 6. Has the Almighty changed?
“For I am the LORD, I change not.” Malachi 3:6
What is the unchanging LORD looking for? Can we allow God to answer this one for Himself?
“But to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.” Isaiah 66:2
“Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams. For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.” 1 Samuel 15:22-23
Whether they realize it or not, those who participate in this strange fire soaking movement are rejecting the Word of God and rebelling. If He didn’t tell us to do such in His Word, we are rejecting Him and His Word to do such.
Isn’t this “soaking” experience just another opportunity for western “Christians” to find another excuse not to deny self, take up the cross and truly follow Christ by doing the real work of the Gospel? Is this just another great escape from true repentance of life and brokenness before the LORD?
“Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.” 1 Corinthians 13:1-3
todd tomasella
www.SafeGuardYourSoul.com
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“AMEN!!!!!!! I truly believe some have become part of this either through lack of spiritual discernment … no knowledge of God’s Word … they don’t understand the spirits behind it. They are all too ready to simply follow after wicked men … and women … They come in innocence … some as new babes in Christ~~they are preyed upon by these power hungry, manipulative … greedy controlling “preachers” feeding them doctrines of demons … It is spiritual rape! Woe unto them!” Bonnie H.
SHOCKING DOCUMENTARY – False spirits invade the church – KUNDALINI WARNING – Andrew Strom
SOAKING? A Spiritual Discipline or Eastern Mysticism?
http://www.crossroad.to/Q&A/church/postmodern/soaking.htm
The Toronto Blessing and the Laughing Revival By Gary E. Gilley ~http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Psychology/char/more/bless.htm
SOAKING? A spiritual discipline or Eastern mysticism?
http://www.crossroad.to/Q&A/church/postmodern/soaking.htm
Hi Todd,
I live in Australia and I have become concerned for the movement that seems to have appeared out of nowhere.
I’ve read a lot on the web about prayer soaking and they use all sorts of Scriptures, but I believe that all they are doing is what writers call “proof texting”, using Scripture to back up to unproven truth.
Now if “Prayer Soaking” is Scriptural, then how come it has take over a thousand years to become a force?
I have witnessed two prayer soaks, and each time my spiritual antenna began to blink.
I believe that all it is, is a form of New Age mysticism, that has come about by the New Age gospel that has infiltrated the Body of Christ since Eugene Peterson’s perverted and watered down version of God’s inspired Word, which is nothing more than a New Age perversion. And Rick Warren’s New Age gospel of having a purpose-driven life.
I am concerned that all of this stuff has come into being since September 11, and the New Age meeting that some Christian leaders attended that was led by the leader of the New Age movement in America.
Now, what have you that might endorse this Prayer Soaking movement? I have an open mind, but I am concerned that these people who lie around on chairs and floors of a church, are opening themselves up to the enemy. I believe it becomes a self-hypnosis.
What do you think?
Love in Christ
George Parker
Australia
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Articles
Addiction’s Only Solution [podcast]
The Victory is in Jesus
There’s no problem God can’t solve.
“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; 32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.” John 8:31-32
Jesus only makes free those who hear and obey Him. Every other “solution” is a cheap counterfeit, yet another trap of the enemy of all souls.
ADDICTION…. good or bad. Sin is the root of evil addictions. Those not doing God’s Word will inevitably be caught up in sinful addictions. Repentance is a must for deliverance.
Firstly, the cross – the crucified life – must be front and center in our daily personal lives. There will be no resurrection victory until there is a definite door nail dead dying and burial. Pour over 2 Corinthians 4:10-12. Attempting to serve God any other way will result is defeat 100%!
“Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.” Matthew 16:24
“This, right here, is your call to obedience. Anyone who claims you can follow Jesus on your own terms, by your own rules, and according to your own desires, is ultimately leading you to a false gospel.” unknown
Good addiction:
“I beseech you, brethren, (ye know the house of Stephanas, that it is the firstfruits of Achaia, and that THEY HAVE ADDICTED THEMSELVES (a choice) TO THE MINISTRY OF THE SAINTS,).” 1 Corinthians 16:15
Those not given over to the LORD and therefore ministering His grace to others, WILL be caught up in sin, evil addiction.
Choosing to be addicted to Jesus
and therefore His work
cures all other addictions.
“But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ. 58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord. … 15 I beseech you, brethren, (ye know the house of Stephanas, that it is the firstfruits of Achaia, and that they have ADDICTED themselves to the ministry of the saints,)”1 Corinthians 15:57-58; 16:15
With no exception, those whom Jesus saved in the past and yet today, those people are not busy about the “Father’s business” of the Great Commission, are living in sin.
“…at the time when kings go forth to battle, … David tarried (stayed behind) still at Jerusalem.” 2 Samuel 11:1
When David was experiencing great victory, he laid back, he ceased being diligent to obey God (2 Samuel 11:1). That’s when the temptation came and he entered into it. The fall out, the reaping was horrendous. Read 2 Samuel 11-12.
“And it came to pass, after the year was expired, at the time when kings go forth to battle, that David sent Joab, and his servants with him, and all Israel; and they destroyed the children of Ammon, and besieged Rabbah. But David tarried still at Jerusalem.” 2 Samuel 11:1
What transpired when David hung back instead of engaging in war?
What happens when you and I hang back, do not forge forth in diligent obedience and abiding in Christ. The 2 Samuel 11 text continues, showing David’s descension into temptation and sin ….
“2 And it came to pass in an eveningtide, that David arose from off his bed, and walked upon the roof of the king’s house: and from the roof he saw a woman washing herself; and the woman was very beautiful to look upon. 3 And David sent and enquired after the woman. And one said, Is not this Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam, the wife of Uriah the Hittite? 4 And David sent messengers, and took her; and she came in unto him, and he lay with her; for she was purified from her uncleanness: and she returned unto her house. 5 And the woman conceived, and sent and told David, and said, I am with child.” 2 Samuel 11:2-5
Remember, EVERY disciple will be tempted in this world. Temptation is not sin. Yet only those who diligently seek, worship, and obey Christ, will be overcomers – which is essential to eternal glory (Revelation 2-3).
“Cursed be he that doeth the work of the LORD deceitfully, and cursed be he that keepeth back his sword from blood.” Jeremiah 48:10
Doing “the work of the LORD deceitfully” includes doing it half-heartedly, ceasing to engage in fighting “the good fight of faith” which includes diligently loving and obeying God, fervently putting forth the “sword” of God’s Word, engaging it against the enemies of God (1 Timothy 6:12; Ephesians 6:17).
“The idea here seems to be that those called to be God’s instrument of chastening upon Moab (God’s enemies) were to be blessed in their work if they did it honestly and boldly; but if they did it half-heartedly and cowardly they would be cursed.” Dake
“But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness. 12 Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.” 1 Timothy 6:11-12
Do we recall what James 1 tells us?
“Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: 14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.” James 1:13-15
Memory Verse
“Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:” 1 Peter 5:8
When the 12 Slept instead of Seeking the LORD
When Jesus’ 12 fell asleep while they were to be praying, Jesus warns them and us …
“And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, could ye not watch with me one hour? 41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.” Matthew 26:40-41
As Christ’s disciple watches and prays, remains ever vigilant, he will not “enter … into temptation”, sin. Memorizing the above words of Jesus (v41) will be a blessing to your life.
Satan offers Band Aids
“They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace; when there is no peace.” Jeremiah 6:14
God is holy, unchanging and gives no peace between Himself and any mere man who is not obeying Him – beginning with genuine repentance, and faith (Acts 20:21, etc.).
“They have – This refers peculiarly to the prophets; making light of these threatenings, daubing over the misery and danger that was coming on the people, by persuading them, that it should not come, or if it did, it would be easily cured.” John Wesley
Giving false hope and false solutions is the work of wolves. Men who pretend to represent the LORD and don’t preach that He is “Holy, holy, holy” and requires absolute repentance, faith, worship, and the cross life (crucified life), are clearly false prophets (Isaiah 6:3; Luke 9:23-24; 13:3; .Matthew 22:37-39; Revelation 4:8, etc.).
Many today listen to the prophesied “MANY false prophets” of this last hour and are reaping the harvest of separation from God and a gross lack of wholeness (Matthew 24:11; Romans 6:23; 1 Thessalonians 5:23).
As long as one panders to and submits to the lies of the world, the false prophets, and their band aid “solutions,” that person will never experience victory. Pills and potions are fake solutions and will only perpetuate the pain and shame.
“If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.” John 8:36
Jesus died on that cross, conquering Satan, and He alone holds your victory over all sin – which is what grants Satan legal right into your life.
“And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.” Revelation 12:11
Only Jesus can make you free and He desires to deliver you and will if and only if you truly repent and submit your life to Him. Jesus says:
“Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.” Matthew 11:28-30
You are either caught up with Jesus or you are caught up in the dismal bondage of sin.
The root sin of all sinful addiction is self-idolatry which can and will only be broken off your life by true repentance, sincerely submitting yourself to the LORD.
“Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.” James 4:7
It’s only if you submit your life to the LORD that He will grant you His power to resist, oust the devil. Then he must “flee from you.” He has no choice at that point.
Satan gains and possesses the right to keep one in bondage as long as that person refuses to truly repent – to truly submit oneself to God. Such a person is caught up in the snare of the devil and therefore unable to resist or stand against and oust the devil.
Charles Pray writes: “So many want to hide their sins, especially those who like to appear Holy on the outside while inside they are dark, unholy ministers of the flesh. They have become a product of their own desires. Dear Lord, please bring them back to their first Love–Jesus! Amen.”
You’re never stuck as long as you have Jesus!
There’s nothing at all that Jesus can’t fix. He promised you this …
“And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.” Mark 10:27
Prayer: Father in Heaven, I come to You in full admission of my sin of neglecting You, of disobeying You, of putting myself before You. I am absolutely in sin and need You to deliver me now Jesus. Please break and make me LORD. This very instant, I now lay my life in Your holy hands. I’m crucified with Christ and I’m all Yours Jesus, from this moment forth. I love You LORD Jesus. Please now fill and use me for Your eternal glory as I look expectantly for Your soon return. In Jesus’ name, amen.
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Apostasy
SINLESS PERFECTIONISM: WHOSE Righteousness are You Trusting? [podcast]
Salvation, justification, overcoming sin all come by way of the mercy of God, the divinely enabling grace of God, and the cross, the daily crucified life (Luke 9:23-24; Romans 3:24-26; 4:4-5; 6:14; 2 Corinthians 4:10-12; Galatians 2:20; 3:1-3; Titus 3:5-7, etc.). It does not come by mere self-determination or self-will.
Don’t strive. Surrender.
Beware of the sinless perfectionism mob.
Beloved, God found us, in our sins, and saved us into His eternal kingdom! (Romans 5:6-9; 1 John 4:19). We didn’t find Him. He found us!
Defusing the iniquity of self-righteousness increases exponentially when we begin learning the biblical doctrine of fallen mankind (Genesis 6:5, 12; Jeremiah 17:9; Romans 7:18; Psalms 39:4-5).
“For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not. … 24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?” Romans 7:18, 24
“It’s actually freedom when we embrace the Bible truth of how wretched we are! We don’t have to hide it or try to be better than we are! Jesus can now reign on the throne of our hearts and not self!” Karen Cochran
Realizing our own utter helplessness, hopelessness, and depravity and taking up the cross is the only the safe place with God right, the cross, the bowing to Him to take full control…. See Matthew 5:3; John 3:30.
All self-righteous religious hypocrites are going to hell (Matthew 21:31). May God save, forgive, and cause us, to bless us to be His authentic disciples. In Jesus’ Name, amen.
Paul’s flesh was and our flesh is a constant reminder of the ever momentary need for the cross, burial, and resurrection grace of Jesus (Romans 6:3-10; 8:11; 2 Corinthians 4:10-12; Galatians 2:20, etc.). Read Romans chapters 6-7 each morning this week.
The cross reveals your sin, and God’s love, not how wonderful you are! Repent!
Saints, we cannot possibly begin to appreciate this “so great salvation” that is Christ until we understand how lost, helpless, and alienated we were in our sin (Ephesians 2:1-10; Hebrews 2:3). We must study to understand the biblical doctrine of inherent sin, fallen mankind, and the holiness of God …. in order to begin to be able to appreciate the redemption that is in Jesus Christ.
Touting our own supposed righteousness is a dangerous undertaking. Lifting ourselves up will result in being brought down low, with no exception.
“Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall.” Proverbs 16:18
All I have to do to find the man most in need of God’s saving grace and mercy, is to look in the mirror (Romans 7:18, 24; James 1:23-24). As long as we neglect to look in the mirror, honestly, we will continue to be self-righteous as were Jesus’ most evil enemies, the religious frauds, the pharisees of His day (Matthew 23). Are we pharisees or humble, broken, honest disciples of Christ? (Matthew 18:3-4)
“If I justify myself, mine own mouth shall condemn me: if I say, I am perfect, it shall also prove me perverse.” Job 9:20
“Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?” Proverbs 20:9
There is NO righteousness outside of Christ (Romans 7:18, 24).
Every single day is the opportunity to overcome – yet this will only happen as we choose to do things God’s way – the cross. Romans 6-8; 2 Corinthians 4:10-12; Galatians 2:20; Colossians 3:3, etc. Sinless Perfectionism Exposed
The no sin nature people are missing the cross. The Mike Desario’s, the Charles Finney’s, and the Jesse Morrell’s of the world peddle the no-sin-nature heresy and also do not preach the cross, the crucified life. They rag on endlessly about “stopping all sin” but never mention the crucified life which is the only divine prescription for overcoming sin (Romans 6, etc.). That alone makes them false, peddlers of “another gospel.” (Galatians 1:6-9) This is why they can’t understand this. They do not realize that God gave us the solution to this sin bent (iniquity), this inherent in fallen man sin – and that answer is the crucified life which is at the heart of the original Gospel.
“True holiness” comes exclusively from the perfect sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Yet this is not just our position in Christ, it must also be the practical reality of our lives lived (Ephesians 4:24). The holiness of God, “true holiness,” requires the “daily” cross Jesus commanded which separates us from self and sin (Luke 9:23-24; 1 Corinthians 9:27, etc.). Sin is overcome exclusively via oneness with Christ in an abiding relationship (John 15, 17) and not by mere self-effort alone – which is antichrist. The point established in the whole of Holy Scripture is that we are beholden to the Savior, the LORD Jesus, and must be honest about our wretchedness outside of a present abiding relationship with Him (Romans 7:18, 24) whereby the fruit of holiness is produced. There’s a slew of self-righteousness being promoted as “holiness” today through wolves who’ve digested the false teaching of devils like Mike Desario and Charles Finney and those who peddle these doctrines.
“But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and 
upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus (not self): 25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation (atoning sacrifice) through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.” Romans 3:21-26
After being attacked and accused of being a Roman catholic, Baptist heretic…. the response to the accuser was as follows:
Thanks for the attack, the persecution. I do rejoice (Matthew 5:10-12). I am certainly anything but Catholic or Baptist. Now, to examine what you wrote ….No one is a more staunch exposer of Rome, nor a more critical exposer of the eternal security Baptist, protestant lie (the ministry has 3 landmark books exposing OSAS – over 1,000 pages total) ….. So what you are saying here is a lie, bearing false witness, instead of dealing with the Scripture truth of these things. There is no cross in this sinless perfectionism movement, and the cross is the only way to overcome all sin – by the resurrection power of Christ (Gal 2:20; 2 Cor 4:10-12). Also, there is no grace (divine enablement) or faith in your message, but rather only rote mechanical obedience as if people are earning their own way. This alone makes your message errant, not according to the whole counsel of Scripture. | Eternal Security Exposed | Catholic Church Exposed
You offer some truth here and yet this sounds like Mike Desario, Charles Finney falsehoods, the no-sin-nature, sinless perfectionism heresy.
Sinlessly Perfect? You Sure? [podcast]
Beware of the sinful self-righteousness masquerading behind feigned perfect obedience. This Sinless perfectionism they are pushing is pure self-righteousness.
I am not your enemy ….. attack if you see fit. Yes, the LORD does say that obedience is essential, it proves that one knows the LORD or is known of Him (Matt 7:21). Good works do not save us – Christ alone saves us. This is a real subtle deception. There is the need to synthesize “ALL scripture” which teaches, that faith, obedience and good fruit do not save us, God does, by HIS sheer mercy.
“Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.” Titus 3:5-7
Sinful self-righteousness has no place in the life of a disciple of Jesus. Matthew 21:31
Self-righteousness was one of the sins of the pharisees and is soul damning (Matthew 23, etc.). Even the publicans and harlots will be in Heaven before the self-righteous religionists (Matthew 21:31).
Obedience is the fruit of saving faith and yet our obedience doesn’t save us. According to this passage, you are under a spirit of witchcraft – to think your own works-righteousness, law-keeping saves you:
“O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?” Galatians 3:1-3
Think about this that Jesus says from perhaps a new perspective … “IF you love me, keep my commandments” …. perhaps He is saying “If you don’t love me, don’t bother obeying Me, because that is futility.” Good works/obedience, fruit are borne out of an abiding relationship. It’s about relationship, not earning our own way I know this well as I was out of balance for many years. I am not seeing this as an argument … just discussing, okay?
There is no cross, no crucified life in the message of the sinless perfectionist heretics and therefore they are preaching “another gospel.” (Gal 1:6-9) The cross is the divine solution to sin and is at the center of the original Gospel and that’s the only way to be raised up out of the flesh and victorious over sin, not be mere self-effort. You are kidding no one but yourself if you believe your own good works are at the ground level of your justification before a holy God who sent His only begotten Son to do what we cannot do. – If righteousness comes out of just sheer obedience, law-keeping, then Christ is dead in vain.
“I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.” Galatians 2:21
God is holy and holiness is essential for eternal glory (Hebrews 12:14, etc.). Yet such comes about by the crucified life Jesus prescribed, the cross and the resurrection (raising up) grace of God – not by seeking to be perfect on our own, not after beginning in the Spirit and then vainly attempting to be made perfect in the flesh (Galatians 3:1-3).
“For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under GRACE.” Romans 6:14
There’s no cross and no grace (divine enablement) in the message of the sinless perfectionists and therefore their message is false. Heretical.
It’s like they seek and are boasting about their own obedience and their own self-willed sinless perfection. Nonsense. Laughable.
Overcoming must be done in and through Christ – in a real, abiding relationship with Him which sinless perfectionist frauds never mention.
Recognizing our own need to be humble, contrite, broken, and fully dependent on the LORD is what we learn in Scripture, not hiding behind sinless perfectionism but rather being authentic, honest, and realizing that without JESUS and being one with Him in an abiding relationship, we can do nothing to please God (John 15:5).
“For without me ye can do nothing.” John 15:5
It’s better to cease pretending in my opinion, in light of the whole counsel of Scripture. I am not a good person, neither are you. “There is none righteous, no, not one” (Romans 3:10). Admit it. The sooner we become HONEST with that which is more than obvious, announcing freely and transparently – that there is “NOOOO good thing” in us except CHRIST, the sooner God will begin a new, deeper work in us! (See Romans 7:18, 24.) The Cross!
We are all very imperfect and in present and perpetual need of the LORD’s saving grace which requires a born again and abiding relationship with Christ.
Those who truly follow Christ are to be fully dependent upon Him, not self, or self’s supposed perfect obedience – which is a farce. See Posture of Dependency
Lest someone should erroneously believe there is any justification for any sin, let me say this: Jesus is coming back for “a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish” (Ephesians 5:25-27), And “By mercy and truth iniquity is purged.”
“By mercy and truth iniquity is purged: and by the fear of the LORD men depart from evil.” Proverbs 16:6
This is how we can observe the ministry of Jesus and His apostles. The only people they were harsh with were the rich and the religious. They were not harsh with people who sinned and were convicted and contrite, humbled before God, seeking His mercy, repentant. The woman taken in adultery is one such example…..
Stone Casting Qualifications
Jesus never called the woman taken in adultery (John 8) or the woman who had had five husbands and was now living with another man, a whore (John 4). Jesus was not harsh with either of them. What does this say for some of these self-righteous, hate-mongering, arrogant, pharisaical, enraged, embattled, need-to-get-saved street preachers so prevalent today who openly call scantily clad women whores instead of winning them as Jesus did? Perhaps it’s the lust in their own hearts driving them? (See Romans 2:1-3.) We never see Christ needlessly provoking, condemning, screaming at, or yelling at lost sinners. WHERE did Jesus or any of His apostles possess such a hate-filled attitude other than when Jesus rebuked them in their younger years for seeking to call down fire from Heaven? Christ rebuked them with “Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of” (Luke 9:54-55).
DID Cain murder his brother Abel because of Abel’s sins or his own?
“Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother’s righteous.” 1 John 3:12
Those who slander others do so because of the wickedness that exists in their own hearts.
No Sin to Deal with?
1 John 1:8-10 should be kept in mind…. synthesized, right? Yes…… 1 Corinthians 2:13
“If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.” 1 John 1:8-10
If we are saved by our supposed obedience, we all fall short, right? Should we not rather trust in the perfect obedience of CHRIST? Memorize Romans 4:4-5. This is in no way to excuse any sin, period (Romans 6:1-2).
“Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. 5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.” Romans 4:4-5
WHO earned our salvation? Jesus.
“For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not.” Ecclesiastes 7:20
FROM A SINLESS PERFECTIONIST:
REPLY:
May God find us with Christ’s righteousness, not our own …. The righteousness Jesus Christ accomplished at the cross is the only righteousness God honors, all else is “as filthy rags.”
“But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.” Isaiah 64:6
What righteousness does God see us in right now? Is it our own, or Christ’s?
“And be found IN HIM, NOT HAVING MINE OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:” Philippians 3:9
Without Christ’s present saving mercy, this disciple is absolutely hopeless, sinful, and doomed. I will trust Christ’s righteousness and not my own!
“Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?” Proverbs 20:9
None is righteous by himself, on his own merit and that what sinless perfectionism teaches….. you are being fed by wolves like Finney and Desario…. you didn’t get this in the Bible, by organic personal study… that’s why there’s an imbalance…..
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Apostasy
Jesus Answered Questions with Questions [podcast]
“AVOID FOOLISH QUESTIONS”
Could it be that one way to “avoid foolish questions” is to ask questions when questioned?
“But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain. 10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition REJECT; 11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.” Titus 3:9-11
One of the best ways to “avoid foolish questions” is to answer them with questions. Read that again.
All questions that come to us are not evil and yet, as we see with Jesus’ religious enemies, some questions do come from evil hearts with ungodly motives.
“For we are not as many, which corrupt (twist, adulterate) the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.” 2 Corinthians 2:17
Jesus used the art of asking questions and so should you. This will revolutionize the way you interact with others, if done correctly. And, this should never be used from a heart that is not pure in the eyes of God. The disciple must beware of the evil that lurks within his own heart (Jeremiah 17:9; Romans 7:18, 24, etc.).
“Asking questions was central to Jesus’ life and teachings.”
Jesus used this method of answering questions with questions in order to shift the burden of proof, expose the motives of his critics, and force his listeners to think deeply.
One commentator notes:
“How many times did Jesus ask questions?
In the Gospels Jesus asks many more questions than he answers. To be precise, Jesus asks 307 questions. He is asked 183 of which he only answers three. Asking questions was central to Jesus‘ life and teachings.”
The Big Question is … What’s behind the question?
WHERE is the questioner seeking to lead this conversation?
We should pray for discernment to know whether there is evil intent or the noble desire for answers behind the questions asked of us.
Questioners with evil hearts ask questions in order to get themselves off the hook or deny what the Bible plainly states. This some do to distance themselves from the conviction of conscience the truth is causing them. And if you buy the package, if you take the bait, they will suck you in and devour you.
Beware of the enemy’s tactics.
“Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices (schemes, tactics).” 2 Corinthians 2:11
“Jesus frequently asked the Pharisees questions. He challenged them. Most of the time He answered questions with questions! He called them out! Which angered them greatly. Jesus was skilled in the art of asking questions! I could learn much from a study of questions Jesus asked.” Karen Cochran
ALWAYS GIVE GOD’S ANSWER AND NO OTHER (1 Peter 3:15): Beware that when God’s Word is spoken, those who love darkness rather than light, those who are unrepentant will divert from the Word by asking you questions off of the WORD itself in order to divert the conviction from their unrepentant hearts (John 3:19-21). STAY with the Word – whether they like it or not (Isaiah 55:11). You owe no man an answer other than to give them what God says – what the LORD stated in His unchanging Word (Mark 13:31). Jesus tells us that such men as will not hear His Word, are “NOT of God.” And, that if they were “OF GOD” they’d be humbly, astutely looking for and hearing HIS Word (John 8:47). Memorizing the words of Jesus recorded in John 8:47 will put your discernment miles ahead. I underlined the key words:
“He that is OF GOD heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are NOT OF GOD.” John 8:47
When you give rebels the answer of GOD from HIS WORD, they will attack you – the mere messenger. They are not there to learn. They’ve made up their minds and are sticking with their rebellion. Always remember, their issue is with the LORD and not with you.
You see, unrepentant men do not like the answer God gives to their questions. They are looking only to justify sin, not repent and confess it as the LORD requires. So their questions are aimed at finding a way to justify their sin – to justify their refusal to truly repent, lay down their lives in this fleeting world, and follow Jesus for real. That’s the crux of the matter.
Isn’t that exactly what the pharisees (false teachers/religionists) did to Jesus?
“Let GOD be true and EVERY man a liar.” Romans 3:4
“Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.” Psalms 119:105
Give God’s answer and no other. You owe no one an answer to anything else, except what God says about it. Refuse to allow rebels to lead you around by the nose with their deflections and questions.
“But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:” 1 Peter 3:15
JESUS ANSWERS QUESTIONS WITH QUESTIONS
Getting a taste of how Jesus dealt with evil hearted religious folks is going to greatly develop your ability to navigate the hate-filled attacks against Christ and you by truth-haters. This will help you as you earnestly contend for the faith once delivered to the saints in the original Gospel recorded on the pages of Holy Scripture (Jude 3-4).
Jesus questioned His questioners and so should you! You serve the LORD Jesus and are not obligated to answer every question that comes your way. Sometimes, you have to stay in control in these situations. I say this specifically referring to conversations you will have with rebels. They have nothing good in their hearts and in many cases, have no heart for the truth, just like the religious frauds of Christ’s day.
Personally, I’ve seldom seen so much evil as when I refuse to answer questions from those who seek to misdirect the conversation away from the Word of God. Often detractors use mere human reasoning, or anything to manipulate and twist and get the emphasis off of what the Word itself clearly states (Mark 7:6-9). This is a tactic they use in order to promulgate their false belief, justifies their sin, and that contradicts Holy Scripture. Such was the case in this recent attack and conversation – Preacher Viciously Attacked for Speaking the Truth! [podcast]
Jesus is THE BOSS and He’s Your Boss! Follow Your Boss. Follow the Example of Your Boss! We learn from our Boss by beholding what He did. And, our Boss, the KING of all kings, asked questions to questioners.
Our Lord was skilled at asking precise questions that drove to the heart of a situation, centering everything on HIS kingdom and never acquiescing to the sinful whims and manipulations of unrepentant men.
Some of Christ’s most profound questions came as a response to those who were questioning Jesus. The following is a list of some of the questions Jesus used in questioning His questioners. This is not an exhaustive list of every question Jesus ever asked and is on record in the Bible. In order to help the reader, I’ve underlined and hi-lighted the words which indicate questions for the reader to capture the essence of how our LORD answered questions with questions. I’ve included also the questions Jesus asked His own disciples. Some of these questions are noble and most (from His enemies) are hostile. As you will see, those questions from Christ’s enemies are obviously inherently evil. I’ve highlighted with yellow where the LORD specifically cites them for such, calling to the reader’s attention the heart motives of those asking the questions. Jesus interrupted their attempted deflections, cover-ups. He called them out on it. Here’s the interaction:
- Matthew 9:14-15 – 14 Then came to him the disciples of John, saying, Why do we and the Pharisees fast oft, but thy disciples fast not? 15 And Jesus said unto them (a question), Can the children of the bridechamber mourn, as long as the bridegroom is with them? but the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken from them, and then shall they fast.
- Matthew 15:1-3 – 1 Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying, 2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread. 3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
- Matthew 15:33-34 33 – 33 And his disciples say unto him, Whence should we have so much bread in the wilderness, as to fill so great a multitude? 34 And Jesus saith unto them, How many loaves have ye? And they said, Seven, and a few little fishes.
- Matthew 17:24-26 – 24 And when they were come to Capernaum, they that received tribute money came to Peter, and said, Doth not your master pay tribute? 25 He saith, Yes. And when he was come into the house, Jesus prevented him, saying, What thinkest thou, Simon? of whom do the kings of the earth take custom or tribute? of their own children, or of strangers? 26 Peter saith unto him, Of strangers. Jesus saith unto him, Then are the children free.
- Matthew 21:16 – And said unto him, Hearest thou what these say? And Jesus saith unto them, Yea; have ye never read, Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise?
- Matthew 26:6-10 – 6 Now when Jesus was in Bethany, in the house of Simon the leper, 7 There came unto him a woman having an alabaster box of very precious ointment, and poured it on his head, as he sat at meat. 8 But when his disciples saw it, they had indignation, saying, To what purpose is this waste? 9 For this ointment might have been sold for much, and given to the poor. 10 When Jesus understood it, he said unto them, Why trouble ye the woman? for she hath wrought a good work upon me.
- Mark 2:5-11 – 5 When Jesus saw their faith, he said unto the sick of the palsy, Son, thy sins be forgiven thee. 6 But there were certain of the scribes sitting there, and reasoning in their hearts, 7 Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only? 8 And immediately when Jesus perceived in his spirit that they so reasoned within themselves, he said unto them, Why reason ye these things in your hearts? 9 Whether is it easier to say to the sick of the palsy, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Arise, and take up thy bed, and walk? 10 But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (he saith to the sick of the palsy,) 11 I say unto thee, Arise, and take up thy bed, and go thy way into thine house.
- Mark 4:10,13 – 10 And when he was alone, they that were about him with the twelve asked of him the parable. .. 13 And he said unto them, Know ye not this parable? and how then will ye know all parables?
- Mark 4:38,40 – And he was in the hinder part of the ship, asleep on a pillow: and they awake him, and say unto him, Master, carest thou not that we perish? … 40 And he said unto them, Why are ye so fearful? how is it that ye have no faith?
- Mark 7:17-18 – 17 And when he was entered into the house from the people, his disciples asked him concerning the parable. 18 And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also?Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, it cannot defile him;
- Mark 10:2-3 – And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him. 3 And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?
- Notice in this exchange below how Jesus is, as always, in charge, in control and therefore answers the questions of these hypocrites with questions and puts them to work – because He knew the hypocrisy of their hearts and what was behind their foolish questions.
Mark 12:14-17 – And when they were come, they say unto him, Master, we know that thou art true, and carest for no man: for thou regardest not the person of men, but teachest the way of God in truth: Is it lawful to give tribute to Caesar, or not? 15 Shall we give, or shall we not give? But he, knowing their hypocrisy, said unto them, Why tempt ye me? bring me a penny (Jesus puts them to work), that I may see it. 16 And they brought it. And he saith unto them, Whose is this image and superscription? And they said unto him, Caesar’s. 17 And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s. And they marvelled at him.
- By Jesus telling these men that they did err, were in error, because they didn’t know the “scriptures, neither the power of God” which comes from proper relationship with Him, He was in part directing them to get into the Word where the answers are found. Mark 12:18, 20-24 – Then come unto him the Sadducees, which say there is no resurrection; and they asked him, saying, … 20 Now there were seven brethren: and the first took a wife, and dying left no seed. 21 And the second took her, and died, neither left he any seed: and the third likewise. 22 And the seven had her, and left no seed: last of all the woman died also. 23 In the resurrection therefore, when they shall rise, whose wife shall she be of them? for the seven had her to wife. 24 And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?
- Luke 2:48-49 – And when they saw him, they were amazed: and his mother said unto him, Son, why hast thou thus dealt with us? behold, thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing. 49 And he said unto them, How is it that ye sought me? wist (knew) ye not that I must be about my Father’s business?
- Luke 6:1-3 – And it came to pass on the second sabbath after the first, that he went through the corn fields; and his disciples plucked the ears of corn, and did eat, rubbing them in their hands. 2 And certain of the Pharisees said unto them, Why do ye that which is not lawful to do on the sabbath days? 3 And Jesus answering them said, Have ye not read so much as this, what David did, when himself was an hungred, and they which were with him; 4 How he went into the house of God, and did take and eat the shewbread, and gave also to them that were with him; which it is not lawful to eat but for the priests alone?
- Luke 10:25-26 – And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? 26 He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou?
- Luke 10:29,36 – But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbour? … 36 Which now of these three, thinkest thou, was neighbour unto him that fell among the thieves?
- Luke 12:41-43 – Then Peter said unto him, Lord, speakest thou this parable unto us, or even to all? 42 And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.
- Luke 18:18-19 – And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? 19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.
- As Jesus “taught the people … and preached the gospel”…. wicked religionists hurled questions with evil intent, questioning Christ’s authority. As His custom was, Jesus answered them with a question.
Luke 20:1-4 – And it came to pass, that on one of those days, as he taught the people in the temple, and preached the gospel, the chief priests and the scribes came upon him with the elders, 2 And spake unto him, saying, Tell us, by what authority doest thou these things? or who is he that gave thee this authority? 3 And he answered and said unto them, I will also ask you one thing; and answer me: 4 The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men?
- John 8:3-10 – And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst, 4 They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. 5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou? 6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. (notice Jesus’ response to their question here – He didn’t answer it verbally but with this action) But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not. 7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. 8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground. 9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst. 10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?“
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