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WHO Do You Love Most?

COMMON DEFENSE OF JOYCE MEYER AND OTHER KNOWN WOLVES: “BUT wait, Joyce Meyer feeds the poor!”

REPLY: Since when do good works save anyone from sin and hell? Never! Hell is full of people who fed the poor. In your mind I guess the catholics, mormons, and every other antichrist cultist are going to Heaven due to the good work of feeding the poor. Feeding the poor and even giving your body to be burned will not save you from hell (1 Corinthians 13). Feeding poor people does nothing to negate the fact that Meyer is blatantly and without repentance teaching blasphemous false doctrines.

The open denial of Christ and idolatry of a mere woman is obvious. Many who are under this demonic spell insist that Joyce Meyer is so wonderful. These same people will never be heard magnifying Jesus Christ nor upholding the written Word of God as final divine authority.

They don’t worship the only nail-scarred risen Savior. You will never hear them say that “Jesus Christ is my only LORD, Savior, and hope!” Their spiritual adultery is obvious! Their own words are telling on them and Jesus says “Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaketh.” (Matthew 12:34) These counterfeits become infuriated when this vile enemy of Christ is exposed … because they have created a soul tie with her and not Christ.

Did you realize that Joyce Meyer is a Word-of-Faith teacher? Are you aware of the Word-of-Faith atonement heresy Joyce Meyer teaches? – that Jesus paid for our sins in hell? What?! Christ told us that His blood would remit our sins (Matt. 26:28). Where is it that His “precious blood” was shed? In hell or or on the cross? Please answer – your eternal soul is in the balance based on whether or not you believe this Bible truth or the false teaching of Joyce Meyer and the Word-of-Faith wolves.

Prosperity Wolves Fraternity! All word of faith teachers MUST espouse several false teachings in order to be a part of that pack of wolves … including the lie that we are little gods, that Jesus had to go to hell to redeem us, and that Jesus (the sinless Messiah) had to be born again … that’s just a start … they are denying the LORD that bled to buy them back from sin and leading millions of others to do so also. Read 2 Peter 2:1-3)

If Joyce Meyer is not a false prophet, who is?!

By believing and teaching this heresy, Joyce Meyer has denied the LORD.

“But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily (secretly) shall bring in damnable heresies (falsehoods that damn the soul to eternal hell), even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.” 2 Peter 2:1-3

WHERE was Jesus when He declared “It is finished”? Was the Son of God in hell or on the cross? (John 19:30) Jesus told us that He paid for our sins by His own blood on the cross – “It is finished” is what Christ cried on the cross (John 19:30). Did the Son of God lie? OR were our sins fully paid for there on that cross? To believe this truth is essential to be saved and to deny it is to deny Christ and be lost. This false teaching (that Jesus paid for our sins in hell) denies the sinless blood sacrifice He offered on the cross. No one can be saved that believes “Jesus” paid for our sins in hell instead of on the cross – that is “another Jesus,” a false Jesus (2 Cor. 11:2-5). Was what Jesus did on the cross not enough? All Word-of-Faith teachers are completely false because they espouse and teach this “doctrines of devils,” and “damnable heresies.” (2 Pet. 2:1-3). The Bible says they are “false teachers” and “false prophets.” (2 Pet. 2:1-3)

Jesus Christ is the only One who paid for your sins on the cross – not in hell as Joyce Meyer and all of the Word of Faith heretics claim. Somebody is lying. Who do you love more, Jesus or Joyce? “Thou shalt have no other gods before me.” (Exod. 20:3)

Is Joyce Meyer making “merchandise of you”? (see Bible text above)

Joyce Meyer says: “You’re on the brink of a miracle. Go to the phone and give $1,000, $5,000, $10,000 and $1,000,000; go to the phone. God has a miracle waiting on your response.” / “The anointing is tangible; some of you should leave your televisions on TBN all night when you’re asleep to get the anointing.” / “This is inspiration, Oh! I heard you Holy Ghost! God is teaching you right now how to hear His voice. Go to your phone!” / “I believe that there are 10 people that need to match that $10,000. You’re believing for the greatest miracle of your life, then sow the greatest seed of your life.” / “You’re not going to your phone; you can hear me while you’re on the phone! Your miracle is waiting! Your deliverance is waiting!” / ” Why are all these heretic hunters trying to get people to know God by criticizing people by name?” / ” I won’t get to the text until you get to the phone.” (TBN, March 31, 2004)

Joyce Meyer says: “God said, ‘you can sow for whatever your soul lusteth after.’ Sow $2,000 says the man of God.” (TBN, April 6, 2003)

Joyce Meyer says: “I just love to talk about your money. Let me be very clear. I want your money. I deserve it. This church deserves it.” (“An Empire Of Souls”, Page 35)

Friend, if you are resistant to hearing an objective perspective about Joyce Meyer, it is perhaps because you have made an idol in your heart out of a mere woman – “Thou shalt have NO other gods before me.” (Exod. 20:3). Is Jesus Christ your “first love” or not? “No man can serve two masters.” (Matt. 6:24) If God’s Word is not first place and does not hold the highest authority in your life, He wants to bring you to true repentance and save you (Mk. 8:38; Jn. 8:47; 2 Tim. 2:16). Jesus is coming for those who are looking to and for Him alone and no mere human (Eph. 5:25-27; Heb. 9:28; 1 Jn. 2:28-3:3). Idolatry is a soul-damning sin (Gal. 5:19-21; Eph. 5:5). Those who will be saved worship Jesus Christ alone and therefore have no idol in their heart (Ezek. 14:3; Eph. 5:5-9; 1 Jn. 5:20-21).

Joyce Meyer
Beauty for Ashes & Approval Addiction
A Critique by Debbie Dewart

Joyce Meyer has become extremely popular through her speaking and numerous books. Although she is not a psychologist, her writings often reference the abuse she suffered in her childhood, and her teachings are similar to the popular psychological “wisdom” about the effects of child abuse. This critique reviews two of her books: Beauty for Ashes: Receiving Emotional Healing (BA), 1994, and Approval Addiction: Overcoming Your Need to Please Everyone (AA), 2005. There is certainly some truth in these books, but it is hopelessly intertwined with psychological error, and great caution is needed.

It is critical to emphasize that the abuse of children is a grievous sin and a real problem in our society. Christians need to respond with compassion, understanding, and hope. This critique is not intended to minimize the harm suffered or the seriousness of the problem, but rather to direct both the perpetrators and victims of such sin to God and His Word, and away from the unreliable theories and methods of modern psychotherapy that appear to offer help yet keep people in bondage.

Meyer’s own troubled childhood forms the backdrop for much of her teaching. In Beauty for Ashes, Meyer points out the fact of her childhood abuse and expresses her belief that many people who appear “together” are inwardly quite troubled:

  • Many, many people seem to have it all together outwardly, but inside they are a wreck. That was my situation before I learned that the Lord’s main concern is my inner life. Matthew 6:33 states that we are to seek first the kingdom (remember, it is within you) and His righteousness, and then these other things will be added unto us (7BA, bold added).
  • I was sexually, physically, verbally and emotionally abused from the time I can remember until I finally left home at the age of eighteen (12BA).

There is a victim mentality that runs throughout her writings.

Victim Mentality

One of the most serious problems with modern psychotherapy, both secular and “Christian,” is the tendency to view people as victims rather than sinners. This victim mentality runs through Meyer’s writings, as in: “Having been hurt and not yet knowing God’s ways of doing things, I ended up hurting my own children” (126BA).

It is this alleged causal link between early childhood abuse (the sins of others), and an individual’s own sin later in life, that is so disturbing and unbiblical. Meyer makes sweeping pronouncements as to this causal link:

  • If we start our life rooted in rejection, it is equivalent to having a crack in the foundation of our house (186AA).
  • I had no frame of reference other than the way I was raised. I had rotten, diseased roots, and therefore, I had bad fruit (190AA).

Meyer proposes a chain of causation that impacts one generation after another:

  • So often, troubled people marry troubled people. After they have destroyed each other, their problems are transferred to their children, who in turn become the next generation of troubled, tormented people (144BA).

If this chain of causation is traced back far enough, we reach Adam and Eve, who had no earthly parents to blame—but tried to blame God.

Meyer’s view of anger is a good example of where this path takes us. Scripture has much to say about ungodly anger (see, e.g., Proverbs 15:1, Ephesians 4:25-31, Colossians 3:8, Galatians 5:19-20), but Meyer traces it to the sins of other people rather than the angry person’s own heart:

  • …when we look at the root of excessive anger issues, they almost always find their seed in earlier problems (143AA).
  • People who have been hurt not only get angry, but often they also seek compensation for injustices done (147AA).

Following Meyer’s path leads to the conclusion that an angry person’s seeking vengeance is actually the fault of another. Rebellion, poverty, “approval addiction,” inability to maintain good relationships, feelings of rejection, inability to express feelings, poor self-image, internalized shame, but also positive accomplishment, are all allegedly rooted in what others have done in the past:

  • Rebellion is frequently rooted in rejection. Rebellious people have experienced the pain of rejection. These people are angry, and their anger is an inner rage that manifests itself in rebellion (197AA, bold added).
  • The root cause of an approval addiction is usually an emotional wound (106AA, bold added).
  • Abuse leaves a person emotionally handicapped, unable to maintain healthy, lasting relationships (21BA).
  • People who have been abused, rejected or abandoned usually lack confidence…such individuals are shame-based and guilt-ridden and have a very poor self-image (91BA, bold added).
  • I once heard that 75 percent of all world leaders have been abused and have experienced severe rejection. When I heard that statistic, I was amazed. It is simply because those who have been abused and rejected work harder than most people to accomplish something important so they will be accepted (198AA, bold added).

How does Meyer know for certain that those who have been sinned against, yet accomplish something important, are doing so in order to be accepted by others? How would Meyer explain the sins of those who have not been seriously abused, those who are raised in godly homes but turn away? What about people who accomplish great things but were not the victims of early childhood abuse? Where is personal responsibility for sin in this picture, where so many life problems are attributed to the sins of others?

Memory Recovery

Focus on the past sins of others often leads to an emphasis on retrieving the memories of those sins and “dealing with” them:

  • Such people [those in recovery from abuse] must get out of their denial and face the truth. There may be things they have forgotten because they are too painful to remember, things that will have to be recalled and faced during the healing process (45BA).

Scripture is misused in order to support this theme:

  • Personally, I will always believe that my mother’s emotional collapse was the result of the years of abuse she had endured, and the truth that she refused to face and deal with. Remember, in John 8:32 our Lord told us: … you will know the Truth, and the Truth will set you free (16BA, bold in original).

This particular passage in John is often cited by psychologists to support the memory-recovery theme, but the truth, in the context of this verse, is the gospel, not facts about past abuse. Nowhere does Scripture command us to recall, rehash, or replay the sins committed against us in the past, in order for our sanctification to proceed.

Unmet Needs

The victim mentality also tends to emphasize unmet individual needs, rather than serving God and others. Like many others, she responds with the claim that God can fill the gap and meet those needs:

  • …if while you were growing up you did not receive what you needed to make you sound and healthy, Jesus will gladly give it to you now (23BA, citing Ephesians 3:17, Colossians 2:7, John 15:5).

Does God meet our needs? Absolutely! Should we look to Him to supply our legitimate needs, according to His riches? Yes! However, problems occur in the self-focused defining of needs—acceptance, approval, and enjoyment—rather than, for example, boldness to speak the gospel or resources to serve God. Moreover, Meyer (along with others) is critical of those who set aside their own needs to serve others: “People-pleasers quickly and regularly set aside their own legitimate needs” (166AA).

It can be a problem to set aside truly legitimate needs (e.g., health or sleep) to serve the sinful agendas of other people in order to win their approval. However, godly people are called to put God and others ahead of self, at times setting aside their own needs and desires for the sake of God’s kingdom. Throughout history (and still today), there are martyrs for the Christian faith, who sacrifice even their own lives. How would these saints respond to the psychological teaching that their own “needs” for acceptance, approval, and enjoyment are more important than the gospel?

Conclusion

Joyce Meyer has become an extremely popular author and speaker. There is a lengthy list of her books in the back of Addiction Approval. This brief review of two of her books (about 11 years apart) reveals that readers dare not assume that Meyer is so “anointed” that her teachings are infallible. On the contrary, much of what she says rehashes the popular psychology that lines the shelves of both secular and Christian bookstores.

[The above article was excerpted from Debbie Dewart’s 54-page position paper titled “Joyce Meyer: A Critique of Beauty for Ashes and Approval Addiction, by Joyce Meyer,” which may be printed from her web site.

Debbie is licensed to practice law in California and North Carolina. She is available to speak on the subject “Civil Rights and Religious Wrongs: The Death of a Christian Nation?”]

Kenneth Copeland

Kenneth Copeland Inside Edition

Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, Rodney Howard Brown, Jesse Duplantis Exposed



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Articles

Salvation is Not a One-Time Experience but a Lifelong Walk [podcast]


WE’VE BEEN LIED TO!

“And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:” Revelation 2:26

Christ’s work is finished, not yours (John 19:30). According to Holy Scripture, if you’ve been truly born again, you must abide in Christ, remain in Him, endure to the end or you will be cast into the fires of eternal damnation (John 15:6; Matthew 10:22; 24:13, etc.).

“Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.” Revelation 2:10

Enduring “to the end” is a condition for ultimately being in Heaven with the LORD.

“And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.” Matthew 10:22

 The LORD Jesus and His apostles never once used the words “once saved always saved” or “eternal security.” So, who’s lying? What they did teach contradicts such a notion.

Who did Jesus promise is going to be “saved”?

“And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.  12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.” Matthew 24:11-13

You MUST “walk in the light” of truth to the end of your life on earth to be with Jesus eternally (1 John 1:7). Only THEN will you be eternally secure!

“But IF we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.” 1 John 1:7

Since when is obedience to the truth legalism or works salvation?

“He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.” 1 John 2:4

Actually, if a person doesn’t have the fruit of good works in their life, it’s because either they have not yet truly been saved or due to their falling away (1 Timothy 4:1; 2 Peter 2:20-21, etc.).

“They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.” Titus 1:16

Who’s Going to Heaven and Who’s Not?

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.” Matthew 7:21

Who’s going to be with Christ eternally according to the Son of God?

“These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.” Revelation 17:14

Those who are “called, and chosen, and faithful.”  God calls and chooses “ALL men to be saved” and yet it’s only those who repent, become converted and endure to the end (“faithful”) who will reign with Him eternally (Matthew 10:22; 24:13; 1 Timothy 2:4). He calls and desires all men to be saved and yet He will only save those who obey Him by repenting and putting their faith in Christ.

EVER WONDER why the OSAS adherent is often extremely vigorous about defending the unconditional eternal security sham he has bought into? What’s at stake for him? Why does he defend this teaching that has no ground in Scripture and that he has learned of men and devils?

The lame, refuses-to-take-personal-responsibility eternal securist hides behind his false facade that nothing he does including sin or doesn’t do affects or is related to his “relationship” with Christ. The word “fruit” appears 67 times in the New Testament canon. So is fruit important to the LORD? Good fruit, which includes good works doesn’t save us but it’s the clear proof that we know Him who came to do us and all mankind good by dying to bring us back to God (John 3:16).

PEOPLE who are hiding behind this satanic lie told by the serpent in the Garden become immediately irate and infuriated when the thin sham veneer of their pretention and self-preservation is pulled open by the truth. The light of truth shines into their darkened hearts. These want nothing at all to do with personal responsibility (Titus 1:16). They don’t care what the Bible teaches. They don’t want their little “eternal security” “I’m saved no matter what” myth busted because they are rebels at heart and refuse to truly surrender – which is what true repentance involves.

We need not kid ourselves, the fruit of our lives demonstrates clearly to God and man who we really are. Jesus taught “For EVERY tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.” (Luke 6:44) …. “Even a child is known by his doings (works), whether his work be pure, and whether it be right.” (Proverbs 20:11)

The Calvinist and eternal securist wants to put the whole responsibility of salvation upon God because he wants no part of personal responsibility to “Be ye holy; for I am holy.” (1 Peter 1:15-16)  This is cowardly is it not? “Fearful” in Revelation 21:8 means cowardly and the lake of fire awaits all who are.

“But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;  16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.” 1 Peter 1:15-16

If you die in sin, HELL is where you end up in (Ezekiel 33:12-13).

What does Hebrews 12:14 guarantee us?

“Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord.” Hebrews 12:14

God sent His Son to pay the full price “for the sins of THE WHOLE WORLD” and those He calls and chooses must be “faithful” or full of faith “to the end” or they will be shut out of the eternal kingdom just as the five foolish virgins were who ran out of oil due to neglecting fellowship with the Bridegroom (Jesus) (1 John 2:2; Revelation 17:14; Mathew 10:22; 24:13). See Matthew 25:1-13.

Explain why we think a bride to be can be unfaithful, commit adultery, fornicate, just before the wedding, and still be accepted as the bride at her scheduled wedding. Delusional. If such were the case, why is this not illustrated, why does it contradict Jesus’ parable of the 10 virgins in Matthew 25:1-13?

If we don’t truly repent and become “honest” with the whole counsel of God’s Word and rather live our one life on lies, namely, the myth that we are “eternally secure”, we shall find ourselves in the domain of the damned, from which we shall never escape (Luke 8:11-15).

Anyone Going to Argue with Jesus?

Jesus taught us that one who is in Him (saved) must abide or remain in Him or that person will be “cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned (hell).”

“I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. 2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. 3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. 5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. 6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned (hell).” John 15:1-6

Yes, salvation begins in the life of the sinner who has been drawn in and found by Christ and chooses to repent and put His faith in Jesus (John 1:12; 6:47; Acts 16:31; 20:21; Romans 3-5; Ephesians 2:8-9, etc.). Initial salvation is instant and yet that’s not the end of it … according to the record of the New Testament Scriptures. Christ and His holy apostles never spoke in terms of salvation being a one-time done deal.

Paul makes it clear that saving grace does NOT abound toward, in the life of any person who has been saved and yet is now living outside of Christ’s stated will, His Word.

“What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? 2  God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?” Romans 6:1-2 

It’s time to get into the Word friends and cease to walk in delusions.

What is the agent that will cleanse the Great Tribulation saints? (Revelation 7:14) – “And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.”

The washing we are to receive of God by the cleansing blood of Jesus is not a one-time event but rather a lifelong walk/experience.  Such is our walk with Christ – it’s an abiding relationship and to abide means to remain (John 15:1-6). And if we don’t remain in Him – we shall be “cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.” (John 15:6) (more on this verse in a moment)

“But IF IF IF IF we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.” 1 John 1:7   

There are conditions for continuing to remain, to abide in Christ’s saving grace. Only counterfeits refuse to acknowledge this. They want no part with personal repentance, laying down their lives in this fleeting world, and truly following Jesus. No, they want the crown but not the cross. They don’t love Jesus enough to truly serve Him and so they buy into diabolical systems like the heretical “eternal security” or calvinistic systems.

The vast majority of pastors and writers today are in gross darkness and treat salvation as a one-time event instead of an abiding, a remaining walk with Christ “to the end” of our lives (Matthew 10:22; 24:13; John 15:1-6; Col. 1:23; Heb. 3:6, 12-15; 10:26-39, etc.).  Many have espoused these lies because they have not chosen to get diligently and deeply into God’s Word for themselves but have rather followed other men’s selective line through Scripture. Those who aren’t diligently studying God’s Word daily are “not valiant for the truth” and will therefore be turned over to delusion and ultimately damned (Jer. 9:3; 2 Thess. 2:10-12).

“And they bend their tongues like their bow for lies (they go to the furthest lengths to embrace lies): but they are not valiant for the truth upon the earth; for they proceed from evil to evil, and they know not me, saith the LORD.” Jeremiah 9:3

Those who do not love divine truth (the Holy Scriptures) manifest plainly that they do not love He who is “the truth.” (John 14:6) God takes that personally and will actually help or assist in their delusions and damnation.

“And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.” 2 Thessalonians 2:10-12

God is able and will keep all who trust Him to the end and do not deny Him:

“Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, 25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.” Jude 24-25

Will Every One Jesus Saved be in Heaven? |  Is Salvation Eternal? | Is Doubting Your Salvation a Bad Thing? |

FEEDBACK:

——- FROM Shannon Cook: “To the “once saved always saved theorists”

5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not “blot out” his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

For something to be “blotted out” (i.e. removed) it would had to have been there in order to be “blotted out” which totally contradicts the theory of “once saved always saved.”

So, who is saved?
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Consider the warning to the church of Ephesus:

4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast “left thy first love.”
5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and REPENT, and do they first works;[or else] I will come into thee quickly, and remove thy candlestick out of his place, expect thou repent.

Laodicean Warning:

“And unto the angel of the church of Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, [the faithful and true witness], the beginning of the creation of God. 15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot,I would thou wert hot or cold. 16 [So then] BECAUSE thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot,I will spue thee out of my mouth.” Revelation 3:14-16 pass it on – Heaven Guaranteed to all who have Received Jesus?

Amen, never to depart from the Christ, he shall walk with us as we endure till the end!
“I will never leave thee nor forsake thee.” Hebrews 13:5 Not never will you leave me nor forsake me. We’re sheep, we have natural, fleshly tendency to wander. Ever reminding us how crucial it is to continuously follow the Christ.

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye [endure] chastening, (there’s that word endure again) God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he that the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof ALL are partakers, then ye are bastards,(illegitimate) and not sons. Hebrews 12:6-8

The elect of Christ have and will experience chastening, and no matter the discomfort in and through it, we always rejoice and know there’s purpose (to the glory of our Christ) as we “endure.”

– check this out – Will Everyone Jesus has Saved be in Heaven?

Reply Received:

“Where do I begin. Every person born of God, WILL be faithful. Even if they are faithless, He remains faithful because He can NOT deny Himself. We are HIDDEN in Christ, and seated with Him right now in the heavenlies. We have passed from death to LIFE. This is an event that is unchangeable. God causes it to occur and doesn’t change His mind. He adopts us. Permanently.

Context is everything. It is king. It determines what a passage actually means. Did you know Todd, that God has saved you forever? It’s great to be free and assured of that. Are you afraid He might not keep you to the end? It’s His desire and intent to do that, bro.

Reply Back:

We only have security in Christ AS we are abiding – remaining – in an intimate relationship with Him.

According to Jesus in John 15, “If a man abide (remain) not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire (hell), and they are burned.” (Jn. 15:6)

In order to receive final salvation, one must abide or remain in Christ (Jn. 15:5-6). There is no guarantee that God’s seed will “remain” in the person who is born again and later departs from the LORD.

What you are doing is simply spouting off what you have been taught of mere sinful men…. speaking of context, let’s look at the context of what you partially quoted, conveniently and selectively excluding the whole context:

2 Timothy 2:11-13

It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.” 2 Timothy 2:11-13

The person seeking to convince others of “once saved always saved” will misquote this text by saying that because “he (God) abideth faithful” He would never “deny us.” This is a distortion. Let’s read the verse again okay? The passage states that “if we deny him, he also will deny US.” The Word here tells us that “if we deny him, he also will deny US.” Does it get any clearer than this? Being honest with what the Bible says is essential to a clear conscience and to possessing the mind of Christ and true doctrine. Again, those who seek to make palatable the unconditional security teaching can be heard misquoting this text saying “He cannot deny us.” Is that what verse 13 says? No. It says “He cannot deny HIMSELF.” This passage tells us that He “will deny us” if we “deny him” and that “He cannot deny Himself,” not us. In this Bible passage we see that the LORD “abideth faithful”to Himself and to those who do not deny Him. Didn’t Jesus tell us to “deny” ourselves and that if we were “ashamed” of Him or His words He would be “ashamed” of us? See Luke 9:23-24 and Mark 8:34-38.

Below is a classic perversion of this very passage of Scripture. I read this on the internet. The persuasion intended by the person who wrote this is to convince people of something the Bible simply never puts forth.

“If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.” 2 Timothy 2:13  God wants you to know for sure that you cannot lose it (salvation) under any circumstance whatsoever, even in the worse scenario. The first part of the verse above says that we can come to a state of mind that we do not believe in God anymore. But, the second says that He will remain faithful if that happens…God cannot deny what He said, because God cannot lie! (Hebrews 6:18 KJV AV1611) He promised to keep us eternally secure and He will remain faithful in that promise even if we ‘believe not.’ Another possible way of looking at ‘he cannot deny himself’ is that we are one in Him. If He was not faithful in His promise, He would be denying himself of eternal security, that is, He would be casting part of himself in eternal damnation in the lake of fire.” J. A.

First off, if in fact as J.A. supposes, “God wants you to know for sure that you cannot lose it (salvation) under any circumstance whatsoever, even in the worse scenario,” then why did God Himself warn His very own people throughout His Word concerning the danger of:

•   “Departing from the living God” (Heb. 3:12-15)

•   Losing the reward of Heaven for turning back into sin after being saved (Ezek. 33:12-13; 2 Pet. 2:20-21)

•   “Falling away” (Lk. 8:13; 2 Thes. 2:3)

•   “Having damnation, because they have cast off their first faith” (1 Tim. 5:12)

•   Being “cut off” (Rom. 11:19-23)

•   Being forsaken of Him (2 Chron. 15:2; Ezra 8:22; 2 Tim. 2:12)

•   Being blotted out of the book of life (Exod. 32:33; Ps. 69:32; Rev. 3:5; 22:18-19)

The fact that God remains faithful in no way predicts or determines whether individuals will partake of His plan of salvation. His faithfulness in no way forces men to remain faithful (abide), nor does it disable the Almighty from rendering a due reward of eternal judgment upon those who do not meet His requirements/conditions. This is a truth completely ignored by those who embrace the unscriptural notion of an unconditional eternal security.

“For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect? God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar …” Romans 3:3-4

All sin will be accounted for – one way or the other, and this is the reason for the Judgment Thrones to come (Exod. 34:7; Rom. 14:12-14; Rev. 20:11-15). This should shine yet a brighter light upon the glorious Gospel salvation Jesus Christ wrought for His people and how we can “come boldly” with our sins to His holy throne of grace to receive grace and mercy in time of need (Heb. 4:14-16).

It seems to me, after listening to hundreds of those who believe in an unconditional eternal security, that some people believe that their theology is going to change the unchanging, immutable God (Rom. 3:3-4; James 1:17). The twisting of Scripture, instead of “rightly dividing the word of truth” is done to one’s “own destruction.” (2 Cor. 2:17; 2 Tim. 2:15; 2 Pet. 3:16-17) The disciple of Jesus Christ must be intent upon studying to show himself “approved unto God,” not men, and therefore be able to “rightly” divide “the word of truth.” (2 Tim. 2:15) The person who does not diligently study and know God’s Word, stands to be deluded by the many false teachings circulated in the church world.

What happens if a saved person does not obey and remain faithful to God? Those who do not choose to persevere in saving faith:

•   Possess “an evil heart of unbelief” (Heb. 3:12)

•   Depart from the living God (Heb. 3:12)

•   Cannot and do not please God (Heb. 11)

•   Depart from the faith through “doctrines of devils” (1 Tim. 4:1-6)

•   “Turn away their ears from the truth” and are “turned unto fables” (2 Tim. 4:4)

•   Cannot enter into His rest or presence (Heb. 3:19; 4:6, 11)

•   Are “broken off” from the LORD (Rom. 11:20)

•   The “unbelieving…shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone …” (Rev. 21:8, 27)

The Bible never guarantees that all Christ saves will automatically “endure to the end” which Jesus says is essential to ultimately being saved into Heaven when speaking to His very own people (Matt. 10:22; 24:13). Christ Himself invented the term “fall away” when speaking of those who would “believe” and be saved and not continue with Him (Lk. 8:13).

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America

IS AMERICA DOOMED? To Stay or to Go [podcast]


Great Commission Evangelism

“This message (podcast) sure nailed the state of America. Rotten to the very foundation. God’s judgment and fury is falling! His very name is being mocked! As so-called Christians participate in and celebrate what He calls an abomination (Leviticus 18:22), and teaching this to children! Where are the parents? Why are they not standing up for their kids? Why are they not pulling them out of these indoctrinated government run schools? Because the men are weak (Ahabs) and the women are Jezebels and busy working. So the children are left on their own. It starts at such an early age they do not know it is happening. No biblical foundation is why kids are murdering kids! No sense of right or wrong anymore. We are a cursed nation because we have deviated from the standards of God in rebellion and disobedience! God will not bless anything that is abomination to Him.” Karen Cochran

Does the unchanging LORD still allow persecution and for His people to be “scattered abroad”?

“And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria, except the apostles. 

2  And devout men carried Stephen to his burial, and made great lamentation over him. 

3  As for Saul, he made havock of the church, entering into every house, and haling men and women committed them to prison. 

Philip Proclaims Christ in Samaria

4  Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word. 

5  Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them. 

6  And the people with one accord gave heed unto those things which Philip spake, hearing and seeing the miracles which he did. 

7  For unclean spirits, crying with loud voice, came out of many that were possessed with them: and many taken with palsies, and that were lame, were healed. 

8  And there was great joy in that city.” Acts 8:1-8

Persecution had hit Jerusalem and Christ’s saints were prepared and “scattered abroad” to go and preach Christ’s Gospel to the world.

Concerning people being “scattered abroad,” one source notes:

Scattered abroad is a common biblical phrase primarily known from the King James Version (KJB) of the Bible. It describes the physical dispersion, spreading, or migration of a group of people. The concept holds both historical and theological significance, typically representing: 

    • Divine Judgment and Dispersion (Old Testament): In Genesis 11, God scatters humanity across the face of the earth and confuses their languages after their rebellion at the Tower of Babel. It also refers to the exile and historical dispersion (the diaspora) of the Israelites for rejecting God’s covenant. 
    • The Spread of the Gospel (New Testament): In the early Christian church, intense persecution in Jerusalem caused believers to scatter throughout various regions. Instead of destroying the movement, this dispersion inadvertently spread their message. For example, Acts 8:4 states: “Therefore they that were scattered abroad went every where preaching the word.” 
    • Encouragement to Believers: In the New Testament, the opening of the Epistle of James (James 1:1) is famously addressed to the “twelve tribes which are scattered abroad,” offering pastoral comfort to Jewish Christians facing trials in foreign lands.”

Any nation that is even discussing whether or not there are more than 2 genders is doomed.

Does God desire to scatter abroad, to spread His people across the world?

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. 

16  He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. 

17  And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; 

18  They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. 

19  So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God. 

20  And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.” Mark 16:15-20

The LORD would never bless a nation that glorifies what He condemns. ANYONE who thinks America is or will ever be blessed without repentance…. is extremely gullible and deceived. Sodom! Ezekiel 16:49-51

“Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.” Leviticus 18:22

A good thing to ask proud Americans who claim they are Christians:

1. “When’s the last time you personally led someone to Jesus?”

2. “How much time and how much energy do you spend trying in vain to “save America” or “Make America Great Again” compared to the time and energy you spend learning, studying, and meditating on God’s Word and doing it—as in the Great Commission?”

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.” Matthew 7:21

Anyone claiming to be Christ’s and yet is not doing, is not obeying His Great Commission mandate, is not in the will of God.

PRAYER: Father in the name of Jesus, may Your people cry out to You today for the lost souls of fallen men for whom You sent Your only begotten Son to die (John 3:16-17). May we be blessed to cry out for that which most concerns You! In Jesus’ name.

As God looks down from Heaven…. here’s what He sees, here’s what breaks His holy heart ….

“Hell and destruction are before the LORD: how much more then the hearts of the children of men?” Proverbs 15:11

SOUND LIKE THE MODERN CHURCH IN AMERICA?

“And he taught, saying unto them, Is it not written, My house shall be called of all nations the house of prayer? but ye have made it a den of thieves.” Mark 11:17

“11:17 Combining quotations from Isaiah and Jeremiah, He condemned desecration, exclusivism, and commercialism. God had intended the temple to be a house of prayer for all nations (Isa_56:7), not just for Israel. They had made it a religious market, a hang-out for shysters and racketeers (Jer_7:11).” Believer’s Bible Commentary

Recently lunatics went half crazy because some man threw a rock or stone at a monk seal. Yet no one is fighting for the right for precious innocent babies to live, to not be MURDERED in their own mother’s womb. America is under divine judgment and it’s not going to stop. It’s just getting started.

“Thou shalt not kill.” Exodus 20:13

“Fact: What the world celebrates, God hates!!

Fact: America as a nation will not be saved by God; only individual souls and families can be saved with the short time we have left.

Fact: The reason society has been overrun by the rainbow mafia in corporate America, in schools, and yes: even in ‘churches’, is because this God-mocking, God-hating nation has been given over to the filth they love above the holy God who gave us life.

Have a blessed day…” A disciple.

PRAYER: Father in the name of Jesus, may Your people cry out to You today for the lost souls of fallen men for whom You sent Your only begotten Son to die (John 3:16-17). May we be blessed to cry out for that which most concerns You! In Jesus’ name.

As God looks down from Heaven…. here’s what He sees, here’s what breaks His holy heart ….

“Hell and destruction are before the LORD: how much more then the hearts of the children of men?” Proverbs 15:11

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Apostasy

Concerns about the writings of C.S. Lewis [podcast]


“Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.” Psalms 119:105

It’s a dangerous proposition to attempt to convey the divine doctrine, the truth, via fiction. Such an undertaking begins on skaky ground. The saints of Christ must get all their doctrine strictly from Scripture, and Holy Scripture only (Deut 4:1-10; Isaiah 34:16; John 5:39-40; 2 Tim 2:15; 3:15-17; 2 Pet 1:12-21, etc.). The writings of CS Lewis have zero divine inspiration and zero divine authority. Anyone who spends their time reading the writings of men, especially those which include very little Scripture (as in the case of Lewis), are inevitably going to be deceived. God gave us His Word to know Him and warned us that “MANY false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many” (Matthew 24:11).

Beware. CS Lewis never even claimed to be born again and yet still has a cult following.

Being born again means one “is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. And all things are of God…” (2 Corinthians 5:17-18) Yet Lewis asserts that “there are people in other religions who are being led by God’s secret influence to concentrate on those parts of their religion which are in agreement with Christianity, and who thus belong to Christ without knowing it.” So, the most profound divine miracle can happen to a person, they can be changed from the inside out, freely forgiven and regenerated, and not even know it? Such a statement from Lewis alone moves me to conclude that he was never born again. And this isn’t even to mention that he was at least in bed with the works-based antichrist Roman Catholic church.

Something to think about, to help you: Why would you be so strongly defending a mere man if that man and his writings didn’t mean so much to you? There seems to be a cult fiction following of Lewis involving people who seem to spend more times of a mere sinner’s fictional musings about God than they do reading about God for themselves in His own Word.

Of CS Lewis, one pastor notes problematic things in Lewis’s writings:

“(1) he was not an inerrantist; (2) he viewed the Protestant Reformation as avoidable; (3) he remained in the Church of England, despite his largely Protestant beliefs; (4) he allowed for “at least some people to be saved through imperfect representations of Christ in other religions”; (5) he gave little attention to the doctrine of atonement.” Then he says: “Lewis is not a writer to which we should turn for growth in a careful biblical understanding of Christian doctrine … There is almost no passage of Scripture on which I would turn to Lewis for exegetical illumination.”

CS Lewis stated: “I willingly believe that the damned are, in one sense, successful, rebels to the end; that the doors of hell are locked on the inside.” Lewis, “The Problem of Pain,” 538.

One minister notes of Lewis’ doctrine that “Lewis never believed in a literal hell, but instead believed hell is a state of mind one chooses to possess and become.” In other words, CS Lewis believe hell was not literal but rather a fiction.

Of CS Lewis, Rick Miesel wrote the following 15 conclusions about the beliefs of CS Lewis:

1. Lewis indicates that shortly before his death he was turning toward the Catholic Church. Lewis termed himself “very Catholic.” His prayers for the dead, belief in purgatory, and rejection of the literal resurrection of the body are serious deviations from Biblical Christianity.

2. His contention that some pagans may “belong to Christ without knowing it” is a destructive heresy…, as was his statement that “Christ fulfils both Paganism and Judaism …”

3. Lewis believed that we’re to become “gods,” an apparent affirmation of theistic evolution.

4. He also believed the Book of Job is “unhistorical” (Reflections on the Psalms, pp. 110), and that the Bible contained “error” (pp. 110, 112) and is not divinely inspired.

5. Lewis never believed in a literal hell, but instead believed hell is a state of mind one chooses to possess and become…

6. On heaven: “All the scriptural imagery (harps, crowns, gold, etc.) is, of course, a merely symbolical attempt to express the inexpressible.”

7. C.S. Lewis’s most outrageous misunderstanding was about the purpose of the death of Christ, which of course mars all subsequent propositions about the effects of the cross and salvation.

8. In his speculations on the hereafter, Lewis is to be criticized for being so extra-biblical.

9. In spite of what many believe to be brilliant exegesis on Christian apologetics (In light of the above, one wonders which of Lewis’s books these people have been reading?), there appears to have been in C.S. Lewis a seemingly irresistible attraction to the shadow world of occult fantasy — a mingling of darkness with light evident in writings apart from his apologetics.

10. Lewis’s early favorite literature included E. Nesbit’s trilogy: Five Children and It, The Phoenix and the Wishing Carpet, plus The Amulet — all occult fantasies.

11. So much was Lewis’s life steeped in fantasy that he wrote, “The central story of my life is about nothing else” (p. 17). From Nesbit and Gulliver he advanced to Longfellow’s Saga of King Olaf and fell in love with the magic and pagan myths of Norse legend. By the age of twelve, there had grown in Lewis’s mind an intense relationship with the world of fantasy and elves… Although one would expect childhood fantasies to subside after a time, in Lewis’s case they became more a delight as he grew older.

12. After advancing to preparatory school at Wyvern, Lewis gradually “ceased to be a Christian.” He became interested in the occult and embraced an attitude of pessimism about what he considered a faulty world. His taste for the occult was nurtured and grew as he became enthralled with Wagnerian operas and their Norse sagas derived from Celtic mythology.

13. It was during their long association that both Lewis and JR Tolkien developed their most prestigious “sword and sorcery” material.

13. It is argued that in presenting a blend of fantasy with analogy to Christian truth, Lewis hoped to encourage his readers to search out the truth further. This, however, was not Lewis’s intention in writing his fantasies… Many of Lewis’s characters in his fantasies depicted as “good” are in reality associated with witchcraft, pagan mythology, and the Norse mysteries.

14. One of the more pronounced confusions of good and evil is Till We Have Faces, Lewis’s retelling of the Greek myth of Cupid and Psyche, written just a few years before his death. In this work, several ungodly concepts are espoused as valid truths.

15. In fact, there has developed a cult of sorts which venerates the fantasies of Lewis along with those of other writers who do not claim to be Christians. Evidence of this is the fact that Lewis’s Chronicles of Narnia is listed along with other occult writings as recommended inspirational reading by the makers of the demonically-oriented game Dungeons and Dragons!

CONCLUSION

According to Miesel, Lewis is also heretical on the depravity of man, how salvation works, being “Born Again,” and animals in heaven. He concludes,

“While there may be insights into life that are profitable to be found in the works of C.S. Lewis, we think it not wise to encourage young or untaught Christians to feed on such a presentation of so-called Christian truth. Some may be readily attracted to Lewis’s style and logic, but let us not be blinded and thus miss the plain and simple truth of Scripture.”

PEACE with GOD

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