Beware of the Denial of Christ’s Exclusivity and Atonement and the No-Sinful-Nature Heresy and Heretics
Does mankind have a sin nature, a bent toward evil? If so, where did that come from? What really happened at the fall? Can fallen mankind, by his own “natural ability”, self-will to overcome all sin? If so, WHY did Jesus come? (Galatians 2:21) | Charles Finney was a false teacher.
As a side, note: I’ve had people disown me for exposing Charles Finney which seems to a cult-like indoctrination and the corresponding devils (demons) that come with espousing “doctrines of devils.” Remember that “seducing spirits and doctrines of devils” are inseparable. Any person who believes a doctrine of devils has evil seducing spirit, a demon in his/her life.
“Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;” 1 Timothy 4:1-2
No one is guilty for someone else’s sin. God holds each individual guilty, fully responsible for their own sin (Ezekiel 18). Yet that in no way negates or changes the fact that something bad happened when man sinned against God in the Garden. If so, rip Romans 3, 5, and 7 out of your Bible. To deny such, to ignore such is the path to delusionment. This has tripped up many otherwise truth-seeking people today. The main source of this poison has come through the heretical ministries of men like Charles Finney.
“Salvation is the work of man.” Charles Finney
The no-sin-nature (“old man“, “flesh”)-to-crucify heresy is just another cross-less lie. It’s peddled by those who refuse to die and who pretend to be sinless perfection by means of their own “natural ability.” Beware of these antichrists.
If there were no inherent sinful bend, bent, iniquitous nature…. WHY O WHY would Paul have repeatedly taught that Christ’s disciples must “keep under” their “body” or flesh, the old man? (1 Corinthians 9:27) Why the cross if there is nothing to daily crucify? Someone is lying and it’s not Jesus and His holy apostles. Beware. Think biblically. | Judgment to Come Necessitates the Crucified Life [podcast]
MESSAGE RECEIVED:
“My question is if Ezekiel says the sins of the father are not the sins of the son and vice versa how does God count Adam’s sin against us?”
REPLY:
No, Ezekiel says the sins of the father are not the responsibility of the son and vice versa. That’s different. In other words the sins the father chooses to commit or walk in he shall long bear the judgment for. God says in Ezekiel 18:4 that each individual soul is HIS and will be rewarded according to the choices he makes while on earth. The father will not give account for the son nor the son for the father. Read Ezekiel 18. There were wicked kings with good children such as wicked king Abijam vs his son Asa who chose to do right. 1 Kings 15.
Ezekiel 18 is the same teaching as this:
The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.” Deuteronomy 24:16
Have you read Romans 5 lately? v12, 18-19
“For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.” 1 Corinthians 15:22
All men are born after Adam and then choose Christ or to reject Him. Matthew 12:30; Mark 16:16, etc.
MESSAGE RECEIVED:
“So, you believe that God has made us fallen? Back to my point, why IF we are made perfect by God Ps 139 then how are we born into a sinful nature? It is either constituted or practiced unto unto total depravity.
My other point was that the moral neutrality that God has given us at birth with the knowledge of good and evil swirling all round us. The weakness of the flesh to temptation and then sin, and then death is easily revealed.”
REPLY:
I would exhort you to put off the things you’ve learned and read Romans 7 afresh. Also Galatians 5:17-18. Call it what you wish, something is raging within, there is a war within. The Bible calls it the flesh, the old man which can only be put off by the crucified life (Romans 6; 8:11-14).
‘For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. 18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.’ Galatians 5:17-18
Why would Jesus mandate self must be denied if there were nothing to deny, to be crucified? (Luke 9:23-24)
You keep saying or asking if I believe God made us fallen. Sorry but I have repeatedly stated that God made us perfect. Genesis 1:31; Eccl 7:29 etc. Of his own God-given free will, man chose to sin against God – all by himself (Genesis 6:5, 12; Romans 3; James 1:13-15, etc.).
You don’t seem to realize that there was a fall in sin-less paradise, in the Garden. And you won’t until read Romans 3 and 5 and believe it. Begin with a prayer, asking the LORD to remove the poison you’ve been indoctrinated with by wicked men such as Charles Finney. v12, 18-19 of Romans 5 for sure.
What happened at the fall? Is the wages of sin not death? Romans 6:23 In the divine economy of God who is “Holy, holy, holy,” does sin not have a profound effect? Are you denying that sin affected mankind? Such would be diametrically opposed to and against the clear teaching of Romans 3, 5, 7.
You are only half way to the truth with the idea of “moral neutrality.” Such would deny lots of what Scripture informs us of concerning our heart being “only evil continually,” “desperately wicked,” etc. Genesis 6:5, 12; Jeremiah 17:9
Those who do not study and know God’s Word thoroughly are susceptible to being deceived by the “many false prophets” that “are gone out into the world” (1 John 4:1). Example: There’s a group of heretics that run around boldly declaring the lie that there is no sinful bent in believers. Nonsense. Mike Desario and Charles Finney were both false teachers.
These dialogues should help clear up the misconceptions and deceptions of those who have been beguiled into this evil theology which denies Christ’s uniqueness, atonement, mankind’s fallen sinful state, and what God has said about fallen mankind.
Lots of gullible dupes buying this package. Beware! Charles Finney’s falsehoods are being regurgitated. This system of falsehood is on the rise. Due to these heresies showing their ugly head as of the last few years, we have addressed this extensively. Here’s a new post with an intriguing dialogue that is sure to clue you in to the way these people have believed and been deceived. Where is your Christology friends? – Please share this page to help others.
SELF-RIGHTEOUS DEVILS will be in hell first according to Christ (Matthew 21:31)! There are lots of novices acting like they have the answers because they learned their heresies from now-in-hell wolves like Mike Desario and Charles Finney. Beware. These are the vilest of devils.
YES God requires genuine faith which always produces good works and yet, GOD ALONE SAVES US – not our own good works! Rightly divide! Synthesize the whole truth! (2 Timothy 2:15)
Some deny that there is a flesh nature to be crucified. Utter heresy.
God made us one way, perfect. But then we sinned and something bad happened.
“And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.” Genesis 1:31
God made mankind and said “it was very good.” Then man sinned and incurred death (Ecclesiastes 7:29; Romans 5:18-19). The details of the curse that came upon mankind when Adam and Eve sinned against God, are given to us in Genesis 3. Death came into man at the fall. Something happened, and it wasn’t good. Read Romans 7.
“Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.” Ecclesiastes 7:29
God made us perfect but WE chose sin and fell and there are consequences for sin, right? And there’s also salvation, redemption, regeneration, choice, the cross, victory that we can choose to receive and walk in.
“Total depravity” is a false doctrine of calvinism which says “we are so sinful and we have no choice about anything. We have no ability to turn to God in repentance and faith to be redeemed, regenerated, made new creatures, temples of the Holy Spirit in Christ.” False.
We have the choice, the privilege to choose Christ and His cross to overcome all depravity, sin.
The Word says things like we are “desperately wicked” right? See Jeremiah 17:9. How about Genesis 6:5, 12 too, right? There’s Romans 3, 5, 6, 7 for the effects of sin, and 8 for the victory of Christ.
The no-sin-nature people are missing the cross. The Mike Desario’s, the Charles Finney’s, and the Jesse Morrell’s of the world peddle the no-sin-nature heresy and also do not preach the cross, the crucified life. They rag on endlessly about “stopping all sin” but never mention the crucified life which is the only divine prescription for overcoming sin (Romans 6, etc.). That alone makes them false, peddlers of “another gospel” (Galatians 1:6-9). This is why they can’t understand this. They do not realize that God gave us the solution to this sin bent (iniquity), this inherent in fallen man sin – and that answer is the crucified life which is at the heart of the original Gospel.
In my understanding…. the no-sin-nature doctrine does not stand the test of the whole counsel of God’s Word. It is vehemently peddled by some today (Proverbs 14:12).
Saints, we cannot possibly begin to appreciate this “so great salvation” that is Christ until we understand how lost, helpless, and alienated we were in our sin (Ephesians 2:1-10; Hebrews 2:3). We must study to understand the biblical doctrine of inherent sin, fallen mankind, and the holiness of God …. in order to begin to be able to appreciate the redemption that is in Jesus Christ.
Sin sure is a living entity called the “old man” which is ever with us and must be daily crucified – put to death (Romans 6; Colossians 3:9-10). If there were nothing to “put off” why would the LORD have told us to do so, so often? Read Romans 3, 5-7 afresh, carefully.
If there were nothing to “put off,” this divine command would not exist (Ephesians 4:22; Colossians 3:8-9). All the Scriptures on the cross, the crucified life, would be useless if there were nothing to crucify – there would be no cross to “take up” which would mean we call Jesus a lunatic and liar for having commanded us to take up the cross, to live a crucified life (Luke 9:23-24; 14:27).
Fallen man’s utter depravity and need for the saving mercy of Jesus Christ!
How can we possibly begin to understand and appreciate why Jesus came to the earth to die if we still see ourselves as anything except “deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked” before a holy God? See Isaiah 6:3; Jeremiah 17:9; Romans 7:18; Revelation 4:8.
Mankind’s fallen state:
“The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?” Jeremiah 17:9
The heart of the human problem is the problem of the human heart.
What do we truly deserve in and of ourselves, being that “all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags” (Isaiah 64:6)?
“But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.” Isaiah 64:6
“O wretched man that I AM” sounds like he’s presently dealing with the “old man” which must be perpetually crucified with Christ in this life – which is a test of who we truly love, self or the Savior (Romans 7:18, 24). This discourse in chapter 7 is leading to the following ultimate solution for sin….
“For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. 20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, 21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.” Romans 8:19-21
Acknowledging that the Bible says there’s a war between the new creature and the tendency to sin in no way means we are captive to it. NO! We have been given complete victory over it through Christ and doing what He told us to do “daily” – take up the cross and follow Him (Luke 9:23-24; Romans 6; 1 Corinthians 15:57; 1 John 5:4-5, etc.).
Because they don’t view the old man as a sinful nature, those who teach this “no sin nature heresy” don’t see the need to crucify it as Scripture commands repeatedly.
“By nature through the fall of Adam, are we the children of wrath, heirs of the vengeance of God by birth, yea, and from our conception. And we have fellowship with the damned devils, under the power of darkness and rule of Satan, while we are yet in our mother’s wombs; and though we shew not forth the fruits of sin [as soon as we are born] yet are we full of the natural poison, whereof all sinful deeds spring, and cannot but sin outwards, (be we never so young,) [as soon as we be able to work,] if occasion be given: for our nature is to do sin, as is the nature of a serpent to sting… By grace (that is to say, by favour) we are plucked out of Adam, the ground of all evil, and grafted in Christ, the root of all goodness.” William Tyndale, A Pathway into the Holy Scripture
MESSAGE RECEIVED:
“I don’t claim to know every secret of God or of human nature and I could even be wrong about some things. But I know this. I will never say that Christ did not come in the flesh (1 John 4:2). For He was made in every way like us (Heb 2:17) Tempted in all points like us (Heb 4:15) and yet without sin.”
REPLY:
Yes but you are doing the same thing (equivalent) by denying His atonement … which is the only atonement. “Atonement” is huge with God and appears 81 times in Scripture. The OT references were pointing to Christ who was to come – “And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the ATONEMENT” (Romans 5:11).
MESSAGE RECEIVED:
“So we have the same flesh as He had. I think we create our own Old Man that needs to be put off.”
REPLY:
Jesus Christ is unique in all of history. He had no earthly father which is the way contamination of sin is transferred via the blood. Study the significance of the phrase “only begotten Son” and you will begin seeing the uniqueness of Christ. He was all God and all man – sinless due to His Father and exercising His will to please Him alone. We though have earthly, sinful fathers whereby death passed upon us (Romans 5). Read Romans 5. You are missing some vital things in your body of truth.
Jesus was tempted and had a personal will (Luke 22:42), but He was more than just a man and this is what the Bible calls “the mystery of godliness.” Read 1 Timothy 3:16 and 6:15-16 closely.
You “think”? Don’t you have a Bible? “Let God be true and EVERY man a liar,” beginning with yourself. Your theology is a concoction at this point – a mixed bag of confusion.
MESSAGE RECEIVED:
“On the other hand I can point out sin to the lost and put the blame solely on the sinner and persuade men knowing the fear of God myself.”
REPLY:
You have sinned and so have I. We must beware of self-righteousness which was the sin of the hell bound Pharisees. This no-sin-nature heresy seems to foster self-righteousness and pride in self… Jesus says that the harlots will be in Heaven before the self-righteous (Matthew 21:31). What I mean by “sin nature” is the potential, inclination, and temptation to sin.
MESSAGE RECEIVED:
“I’m not emailing you to support Finney. I’m emailing you because I work with the woman who is Lutheran and I know that she is deceived. I gave her a gospel tract that talked about how Jesus saves FROM sin, not IN sin. And one of her excuses was that she had a sinful nature. In other words she defined ‘sinful nature’ as a permanent thing that was inescapable. You define the term as escapable.
I become frustrated at times when I hear nominal Christians with an attitude that they can’t escape a nature they were born with or that they are saved no matter what they do. I’m frustrated out of love for their souls and not to prove some selfish doctrine. I hope you can forgive me if I have made you stumble in any way.
I was hoping to get some insight into someone who held to ‘sinful nature’ and yet believed in crucifying the flesh with its passions and desires.
In terms of my own beliefs I don’t totally subscribe to any theologian, whether it be Finney, Augustine, Edwards, Grudem, Luther, Wesley, Spurgeon, etc.. I feel it is important to study entire church history because it helps me understand where people are coming from.
As far as my own beliefs I believe Christ has freed me from the bondage that I sold myself into. It’s nothing more or less than that.
Again I call anyone a brother who worships Christ in spirit and truth.
I just wanted to poke a bit and see what you thought. Thank you for your videos on YouTube and I appreciate your time.”
REPLY:
God saves first – He regenerates. Then sin is forgiven and He grants His power to overcome. Salvation is not only about sin but about salvaging the relationship between Himself and mankind. The woman taken in adultery was first and foremost forgiven by Christ and THEN and only THEN told to “go and sin no more” (John 8). You have learned from deceived men to reduce Christ’s salvation to only overcoming sin which has taken the worship focus away from Him (Colossians 2:18-19). The spirit of antichrist is behind this. God is not interested in you feigning to be overcoming sin if you are not engaging in an abiding cross relationship with Him (John 15). Salvation is about restored relationship and fellowship with the Father and Son and not only about the removal of sin although that is essential to the reconciliation of that vital relationship (Colossians 1:12-14).
You said: “she defined ‘sinful nature’ as a permanent thing that was inescapable.” You define the term as escapable.” I define it as being “present” and essential to crucify via that “daily” cross Jesus commanded (Luke 9:23-24). But you are denying it against the clear teaching of Scripture. Paul the apostle wrote: “I find then a law, that, when I would do good, EVIL ISSSSS PRESENT WITH ME” (Romans 7:21). “Is” here makes it plain that after Paul’s conversion, sin was still “present” with him and had to be “put under” or mortified (Romans 6:-8; 1 Corinthians 9:27).
I agree that Calvinistic theology is completely false and yet, we cannot base truth on what others are falsely teaching. Truth is God’s Word (John 17:17), and we must honestly and objectively engage in “rightly dividing” it by thorough “study” of it (2 Timothy 2:15). What you are saying is clearly contradicting known truth. The sinful nature is only escapable at death. As long as we are in the body, we shall be tempted to conform to that evil nature, and given the opportunity to put it off (“put off the old man” and to “put on the new man”) (Ephesians 4:22-24; Col. 3:5-10). Listen closely to Paul here: – “For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time (including mortifying the sinful nature/flesh-v. 13) are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. 19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. 20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, 21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain (under the curse caused by man’s sin) together until now. 23 And not only they (the lost), but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.” Romans 8:18-23
This passage above further makes it crystal clear that we, “which have the firstfruits of the Spirit,” are groaning and travailing under sin’s gravity, “waiting for the manifestation of the sons of God” when we die or Christ returns. It’s then when “4 God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. 5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful” (Revelation 21:4-5).
Romans 8:21 says that “the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption” and in the context of this passage, that’s clearly in eternity, not now.
Here’s your problem – you are basing your doctrine on 1) what you’ve heard from other mere men, and 2) what others are saying … instead of going only by the whole counsel of Scripture. You state: “I become frustrated at times when I hear nominal Christians with an attitude that they can’t escape a nature they were born with or that they are saved no matter what they do. I’m frustrated out of love for their souls and not to prove some selfish doctrine. I hope you can forgive me if I have made you stumble in any way.” First off, the LORD has blessed me to minister to individuals for 30 years now daily and I hear the same thing. No, I am not moved by this false system of theology and dealing with what people we minister to say (making excuses). The answer is not to deny what God’s Word clearly says is “present” with us (Romans 7:21), but rather to be instructed by the LORD and His holy apostles to “keep under” and to “crucify” and to “mortify the deeds of the body.” That’s God’s answer – not denying that evil is still present with us.
You said: “I was hoping to get some insight into someone who held to ‘sinful nature’ and yet believed in crucifying the flesh with its passions and desires.” This is correct actually – we have an evil nature and it must be daily mortified.
It is my opinion that you are being routed by the enemy by even giving place to and wasting time studying any person after Christ and His apostles. Let’s admit that we don’t even know God’s Word nearly as we should and could and so are wasting His precious time in our lives He gave us looking at what mere men said, taught, and believed. You said: “In terms of my own beliefs I don’t totally subscribe to any theologian, whether it be Finney, Augustine, Edwards, Gruden, Luther, Wesley, Spurgeon, etc. I feel it is important to study entire church history because it helps me understand where people are coming from.” ALL you need is God’s Word, and so reading, studying, and memorizing it bring ALL the answers (Psalms. 119:42; 2 Timothy 2:15; 3:15-17; 4:2-4; 1 Peter 3:15; 4:11; 2 Peter 1:3-4, 19-21, etc.).
Again, this is dangerous: “As far as my own beliefs I believe Christ has freed me from the bondage that I sold myself into. It’s nothing more or less than that.” If you have truly repented and put your faith in Christ (Acts 20:21), He regenerated you, made you a new creature in Christ, and gave you His “divine nature” (John 3:3, 7; Titus 3:5-7; 2 Corinthians 5:17-18; 2 Peter 1:3-4).
You seem humble and that’s a good place for us to be and to remain… teachable (Proverbs 1:5; 6:23; 15:32, etc.). He has much for us to learn.
MESSAGE RECEIVED:
“One additional thought. I’m not sure how you arrived at the fact I subscribe to Charles Finney. I specifically said when we repent God puts us “In Christ” (kind of like being put into Noah’s Ark) and thus are sanctified through Christ and his faith and righteousness. Someone isn’t a Finneyist because they deny sinful nature. I see that someone is a Finneyist if they subscribe to his systematic theology, moral government etc.
I just read in the bible that David said “I am fearfully and wonderfully made” and that babies in the womb know neither good nor evil. And I see that people “go astray”, meaning that they leave of their own volition. And I believe that God forgives small children if they sin. 1 John2:12 I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name’s sake.
Also I don’t subscribe to any atonement theory whatsoever. Subscribing to an atonement theory only divides the brethren. It’s a source of division only. I do believe Christ frees from the captivity of sin, and I know that’s no theory. I’ve felt it personally in my life.
And if your point of calling out Finney is to correct error of sanctification by works then I support you in that cause.”
REPLY:
You have bought into and are overreacting to the error of others (mainly Calvinists) and thereby make an equally damaging, false error yourself and are openly denying Christ the only Redeemer.
Where did you get this teaching? It came from man and not God. You didn’t learn this from just and only reading Scripture. I know you say you just read the Bible but I am certain you have arrived at this via some man or mere men. You are forcing Scripture to say what you have concluded, holding to your tradition and setting God’s Word aside (Mark 7:6-9). You are allowing your tradition to trump Scripture.
What does “fearfully and wonderfully made” really mean? Does that cancel the meaning and revealed divine truth of other Scriptures? No. After God created man He said it was “good” and yet that was BEFORE man fell. After man fell He says we are “corrupt,” and “desperately wicked,” and have sinned against Him and are shown to be (concluded) guilty (Romans 3:19; 11:32). Without Christ’s “regeneration” (“born again”) we are “dead in trespasses and sins” and by “NATURE” the children of wrath (Ephesians 2:1-3; Titus 3:2-7).
Paul used the phrase “MYSTERY of iniquity” and so perhaps there is a mystery. Romans 7 may lend to that thought also. There IS a struggle within which seems to indicate two, not one nature – one that must be crucified and dominated by the power of the Spirit of God (Galatians 5:17-18; Romans 8:13; 1 Corinthians 9:27). Paul didn’t say “O wretched man that I WAS” but rather “O wretched man that I AM” (Romans 7:24). This seems to further demonstrate that he still had an evil nature to overcome – to mortify daily. That’s the whole purpose of the daily cross – so that the LORD will increase and we decrease (John 3:3o). It seems clear from Scripture that we should cease to deny the sin nature and simply obey God’s Word by crucifying it daily (Luke 9:23-24). We as His children have a personal will as even Jesus did and must choose His will over ours – “not MY will but thine be done” (Luke 22:42). Jesus had a will and we have a will – which we all choose to exercise as we choose in obeying or disobeying God.
Are you going to deny the war Paul spoke of? “For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.”
“But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.” Galatians 5:17-18
“The truth is that while Christ dwells in the believer’s new nature, He has strong competition from the believer’s old nature. The warfare between the old and the new goes on continually in most believers.” AW Tozer
To overlook the reality of this war within is to reveal our limited view of the full counsel of Scripture or refusal to acknowledge it. I want to encourage you to take a step back prayerfully to seek the LORD’s face – asking Him that your heart would be established with His grace and not with meats (Hebrews 13:9; Ezekiel 36:24-26).
Now I am wondering if you are truly saved and I say that with all carefulness and concern. To quote you: “Also I don’t subscribe to any atonement theory whatsoever. Subscribing to an atonement theory only divides the brethren. It’s a source of division only. I do believe Christ frees from the captivity of sin, and I know that’s no theory. I’ve felt it personally in my life.”
Atonement is a “theory”? Forget dividing the brethren – you are denying Christ wholesale and calling God a liar. You are able to save yourself and atone for yourself? So, God sent His only begotten Son in vain? There was no need for at-one-ment? This is exactly what Finney taught and is antichrist – it exes out Christ, says that “Christ is dead in vain” (Galatians 2:21). It says that man can make his own way to God and that overcoming sin is the pinnacle of being right with God instead of Christ being the only Mediator between God and man. The Bible teaches us that salvation is in a Person – Jesus Christ – and not in what we can do to rid ourselves of sin. Such a notion replaces Christ with self (definition of antichrist) and makes us Luciferic. This is a deadly and damnable heresy – “even denying the Lord that bought them.” (2 Peter 2:1-3)
You said: “I do believe Christ frees from the captivity of sin, and I know that’s no theory. I’ve felt it personally in my life.” – So, what came first: 1) freedom from sin or 2) atonement and regeneration? Making you one with Him through regeneration/being born again and given a new nature – made a new creature in Christ? In your mind salvation is simply being freed “from the captivity of sin” and not in knowing and being known of God (John 15:14; 17:3; 1 Corinthians 8:3; Philippians 3:10). This is Gnosticism where personally knowing the LORD is subtly denied and replaced with mere head knowledge. You are reducing “salvation” to something far less than God reveals it to be by denying Christ right out of the picture which is the workings of “that spirit of antichrist” and “the spirit of error” (1 John 4:1-6).
It is my opinion that God is giving you the opportunity through this conversation to come to Him in honesty and sincere humility, returning to Him in repentance.
God sent His only begotten Son to be the only (exclusive) offering for fallen mankind’s sin to bring His atonement for mankind’s sin (Isaiah 53). The LORD Jesus Christ was the prophesied, exclusive Lamb of God who came to take away the sins of the world (Matthew 1:21; John 1:29). He alone made atonement and to teach that we have no sin to be atoned for is to deny Christ openly. Jesus alone “taste(d) death for every man” (Hebrews 2:9). Denying or feigning to overcome sin (a farce) without Jesus’ atonement and regeneration is brazen denial of the whole plan of God in sending His only begotten Son. This makes one lost and antichrist.
“For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation (atoning sacrifice) through faith in his blood (not faith in ourselves), to declare HIS righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.” Romans 3:23-28
God alone justifies and He made that exclusively through Christ Jesus, the only “propitiation” or atoning sacrifice for our sins. This is exactly what He depicted in Leviticus 16-17 with the scapegoat. He alone fulfilled this picture when He came as “THE Lamb of God” to take “away the SIN (not just the sins) of the world” (John 1:29). The singular use of “sin” here is telling.
If we are not born with a sinful nature, WHY does God regenerate us – make us born again, new creatures in Christ? Why does He change our nature? (2 Corinthians 5:17-18) Are we not “partakers of the divine nature”? (2 Peter 1:3-4)
todd
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Notes:
As should be obvious, we continue to war against this Charles Finney system of lies that denies Christ’s atonement and what He instructed us to do in taking up the cross and deny self
No propensity toward sin?
Yes there is an evil in us, a potential, an inclination toward evil that must be crucified …. To say or to insinuate that there is nothing to be denied or crucified daily, always, perpetually, we are saying that Christ and His apostles are fools ….. because they said that such were essential (Lk. 9:23-24; John 12:23-25; Gal. 2:20; 5:24; Col. 3:3; Rom. 6, etc. ….. Seems to me that sin had an horrible effect on human nature …. Rom. 5:18-19. ….When we “were dead in trespasses and sins,” we “were BY NATURE the children of wrath, even as others” (Ephesians 2:1-3). See also Romans 7.
The answer is not to deny the sinful tendencies but rather to obey Christ by crucifying that nature…..
God doesn’t expect you to sin. He commands and expects you to live holy and gives you totally mastery over all temptation to sin through the power of His Spirit and the crucified life (Romans 6:14; 8:12-14, etc.).
There’s no excuse for sinning. If a Christian sins it is always that Christians fault, never God’s fault (James 1:13-15).
1 John 2:1-2
Like the heretic they follow, they teach that it’s your own “natural ability” that you overcome and not by the power and saving grace of the LORD Jesus Christ. Gal 3:3
Are there sinful tendencies in fallen man? Yes.
Does this mean he is captive to those sinful bents after regeneration? No. In fact, redeemed men have been given complete grace and divine power over all sin (Romans 6; 8:12-14, etc.).
Are sinful men captive to sin before regeneration? Yes. Unregenerate man has no saving grace to overcome sin or to “stop sinning” as some foolishly assert. Sinners “by nature” serve their sinful dictates and the enemy of souls (Ephesians 2:1-3).
Unregenerate man cannot “stop sinning” until he personally meets the only One who came and died to redeem and regenerate him (Galatians 2:20-21; Titus 3:2-7, etc.).
The ability to conquer all sin is the stated will of God and yet that divine ability (Grace = divine ability) does not enter the saved person until he is first saved. So how can someone “stop all sinning” before being saved by grace? Impossible. And, that is unmitigated idolatry, antichrist – putting self before, in place of Christ who alone is Savior and LORD. Repentance is first and foremost turning TO GOD and not turning from sin. If you get these out of order, you are a heretic.
***These people are under the spirit of antichrist. They are touting their own “natural ability” to make the right decisions while denying the need for Christ’s regeneration and present saving, enabling grace (divine influence on their hearts and empowerment in their lives). They deny Christ in that they believe they overcome by their own personal will alone and not by the power and grace of Jesus Christ. John 1:12-13
Hosea 4:6; Colossians 2:18-19
One writer notes:
“The recognition of the sin nature is exactly why must take up the daily cross. The branch cut away from the wild olive tree and grafted into the new tree still has a residue of the old sap and bark.”
Abiding
The Chosen are being Called and Prepared to “Go” [podcast]
Jesus didn’t say “stay.”
Jesus commanded us to “Go” ( Matthew 28:18-20).
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.” Mark 16:15
“They Desire a Better Country”
“Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country , and from thy kindred, and from thy father’s house, unto a land that I will shew thee:” Genesis 12:1
“By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange COUNTRY, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:” Hebrews 11:9
“For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a COUNTRY.” Hebrews 11:14
“And truly, if they had been mindful of that COUNTRY from whence they came out, they might have had the opportunity to have returned.” Hebrews 11:15
“But now they desire a better COUNTRY, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he has prepared for them a city.” Hebrews 11:16
Billions lie unreached.
” Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.” Psalms 2:8
BE WARNED….
That if you dare ask God to prepare and use you, the adventure of serving as you are accomplishing His Great Commission is going to begin and gain steadily increasing traction and fruitfulness! Read John 15:1-16.
It all begins with a simple, sincere prayer, a request to God to use you — and therefore begin now to prepare you.
“If a man therefore purges himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honor, sanctified, and met for the master’s use, and prepared unto every good work.” 2 Timothy 2:21
The LORD can use us to the degree we’ve sought Him for and submitted to His strippings, purgings, His preparation.
“See, I have this day set thee over the nations and over the kingdoms, to root out, and to pull down, and to destroy, and to throw down, to build, and to plant.” Jeremiah 1:10
God has a plan to remove that which does not belong in you and to establish what does.
- “to root out” (destructive)
- “to pull down” (destructive)
- “to destroy” (destructive)
- “to throw down” (destructive)
- “to build” (constructive)
- “to plant” (constructive)
When Jesus cleansed the temple, after rooting out the evil, He then installed the purity, prayer, praise, and power (Matthew 21; John 2).
God has His order. One thing comes before the other.
When you Go, that’s when you are going to Know!
“Christianity is not American and America does not define Christianity! We need to stop trying to merge the two together. Jesus died for people all over this world, and Christianity existed long before America was even a thought. I am a Christian who physically resides in the USA, but this world is not my home. I long for an eternal kingdom.” Gloria Sykes
When you obey Christ and “Go” there will be a harvest of souls — some you will see and many you will not.
” They that sow in tears shall reap in joy. 6 He that goeth forth and forth, bearing precious seed, shall doubtless come again with rejoicing, bringing his sheaves with him .” Psalms 126:5-6
Thanking God and you for pausing to lift up the blessed saved souls to Jesus in PA. From Tom and Karen Cochran:
“God has opened up a door for us to minister in a nursing home. People in there are hungry. They have been stripped of their pride! They need help just to do everyday things we take for granted. Very few have family or friends who visit. All their material possessions are pretty much gone, and once put in a home they know this is probably where they will die. They have no hope. And that is why they are hungry! Jesus gives them hope! We have seen many completely changed by the gospel and power of Christ! Jesus saved one-hundred- and-five-year-old woman, and after she prayed she began to sing ‘Jesus loves me this I know, for the Bible tells me so’!”
People are eternal. Are you investing in people, eternal souls?
Are you personally participating in, contributing your time, talents, and treasures into the Great Commission Jesus gave us? See the end of Matthew and Mark.
MESSAGE ON AMERICA:
“Lately I have been seeing many taking to the streets to preach the gospel and it is shocking to see the response of Americans. In their pride and arrogance they keep right on walking and don’t even look up. Too busy in their comfortable lives. Headed for the path of destruction and they could care less.”
REPLY:
Seems this is how America could, should be viewed: “And whoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet. 15 Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city” (Matthew 10:14-15).
Who are the people who are going to be with Jesus?
“These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are CALLED, and CHOSEN, and FAITHFUL.” Revelation 17:14
Luke 9:57-62
” And it came to pass, that, as they went in the way, a certain man said unto him, Lord, I will follow thee whithersoever thou goest. 58 And Jesus said unto him, Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head. 59 And he said unto another, Follow me. But he said, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father. 60 Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury their dead: but go thou and preach the kingdom of God. 61 And another also said, Lord, I will follow thee; but let me first go bid them farewell, which are at home in my house .
Of this passage at the end of Luke 9, one writer notes the following:
“9:61 The third would-be disciple resembled the first in that he volunteered to follow Christ. He was like the second in that he uttered the contradiction, “Lord…me first.” He wanted first to say goodbye to his family. In itself, the request was reasonable and proper, but even the common civilities of life are wrong if they are placed ahead of prompt and complete obedience.
9:62 Jesus told him that once he put his hand to the plow of discipleship, he must not look back; otherwise he was not fit for the kingdom of God. Christ’s followers are not made of half-hearted stuff or dreamy sentimentality. No considerations of family or friends, although lawful in themselves, must be allowed to turn them aside from utter and complete abandonment to Him. ….
And so we have three cardinal hindrances to discipleship illustrated in the experience of these men:
1. Material comforts.
2. A job or an occupation.
3. Family and friends.
Christ must reign in the heart without a rival. All other loves and all other loyalties must be secondary.”
Matthew 9:35-38
The 3 Ways God’s People Participate in Christ’s Great Commission
1. Praying for Christ’s laborers (Matthew 9:35-38).
2. Witnessing, sowing and communicating the Word (Matthew 28:18-20; Mark 16:15; Luke 8:11).
3. Supporting, supplying those of God’s people who are doing His Great Commission, preaching the Word (Matthew 6:19-21; 2 Corinthians 9:6-11; Philippians 2:25; 4:16-20).
“For me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” Philippians 1:21
PRAYER: LORD, sanctify my life. This is YOUR life. Put me exactly where you want me on Your planet. Use this life dear LORD. In Jesus’ name.
Prepared to be Used of God | Great Commission
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Articles
“A Just Weight is His Delight” and Gouging is Sin
Gouging is Ungodly – and God is Watching, Sees All, and will Repay Accordingly
“Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. 8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.” Galatians 6:7-8
Scripture informs us of the LORD that “true and righteous are thy judgments” and God requires that those who know Him will deal justly – in just weights and measures (Revelation 16:7).
“He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?” Micah 6:8
Doing justly before God would mean dealing equitably with men. When you read the following passage, keep justice, greed, and fearing God in mind:
“A false balance is abomination to the LORD: but a just weight is his delight. 2 When pride cometh, then cometh shame: but with the lowly is wisdom. 3 The integrity of the upright shall guide them: but the perverseness of transgressors shall destroy them. 4 Riches profit not in the day of wrath: but righteousness delivereth from death. 5 The righteousness of the perfect shall direct his way: but the wicked shall fall by his own wickedness. 6 The righteousness of the upright shall deliver them: but transgressors shall be taken in their own naughtiness. 7 When a wicked man dieth, his expectation shall perish: and the hope of unjust men perisheth. 8 The righteous is delivered out of trouble, and the wicked cometh in his stead.” Proverbs 11:1-8
Wicked unrepentant people forge ahead in their sin, continuing to live separated from God, vainly believing that because He hasn’t yet judged them that He won’t in the future. Justice is a death march to the irrevocable fire of eternal hell.
“Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil.” Ecclesiastes 8:11
So when you go to a store, who has decided the pricing on each item? you or them? obviously when 2 individuals negotiate for the sale of an item between themselves, they come to an agreement on the price. the fact that a person in a situation like this, can pay whatever they wish for something if it has value to them, in no way negates just weights and measures as begins with God Himself …. There are standards to be measured against in determining the value of something. you can’t blank out what we find originating in Scripture. So, have you ever heard of real estate appraisal? If so, what’s this field of work for? What does it measure? What’s its purpose?
Charging more than the actual value is sin unless the buyer requests to pay more for it perhaps in order to obtain the item before someone else does.
Gouging arises from wicked hearts who greedily covet the things of this fleeting world. Greed is not a virtue, it’s a soul damning sin.
“Labour not to be rich (the sin of greed): cease from thine own wisdom. 5 Wilt thou set thine eyes upon that which is not? for riches certainly make themselves wings; they fly away as an eagle toward heaven. 6 Eat thou not the bread of him that hath an evil eye, neither desire thou his dainty meats: 7 For as he thinketh in his heart, so is he: Eat and drink, saith he to thee; but his heart is not with thee. … 17 Let not thine heart envy sinners: but be thou in the fear of the LORD all the day long.” Proverbs 23:4-7, 17
The utmost fear and wisdom of God must be observed from His Word when setting prices for products and services. Seems best to under price a bit rather than over price, gouge. In the flesh, is it not easy to get greedy when setting prices for the product and/or services your company offers? Yet what is the long term affect on your community, your clients?
Think about those people you’ve done business with who price fairly and how that made you feel about them and how it affected your repeat business with them. Seems to me that those who fairly price their product/services are exponentially more likely to be established in a community with good reputation and honor.
“A good name is rather to be chosen than great riches, and loving favour rather than silver and gold.” Proverbs 22:1
In every economy there are standards of measure and appropriate pricing or prices set accordingly…. The further a people distance themselves from God, from the instruction of His Word, the deeper in rebellion that nation plunges, the more skewed are the weights and measures. John Quincy was instrumental in laying the foundation for just weights and balances in America.
“John Quincy Adams, sixth President of the United States, liked to measure things – the width of a river, the distance between two points – by counting his steps…. When Adams became Secretary of State in 1817, his fascination with measurements coincided with the desire of Congress to establish a uniform standard for weights and measures across the United States. After three-and-a-half years of obsessive work (which frustrated his wife, Louisa), John Quincy Adams produced his Report Upon Weights and Measures. He thought it would be his most important literary accomplishment.
Fixing the Standard of Weights and Measures
The importance of everyone in the country using the same system of weights and measures was recognized by the founders of the United States. The Constitution gave Congress the power to ‘fix the Standard of Weights and Measures’ (Article 1, Section 8, Clause 5). However, there was no agreement as to which weights and measures should become the national standard. Each of the original thirteen states was using its own weights and measures, which differed from those used by other states. No Congressman wanted to be blamed for changing his constituents’ customary way of measuring things.
All of the early presidential messages to Congress included an appeal for legislation to establish a uniform system of weights and measures. In 1790, at the urging of George Washington, the House of Representatives asked Secretary of State Thomas Jefferson to draw up a plan. Jefferson put forward two options: one a refinement of the existing English system of weights and measures; the other a new decimal system based on the foot. Jefferson’s report was transmitted by the House to the Senate, where a select committee concluded that, since Britain and France were each considering national standards of measure which could become a universal standard, it was not desirable, ‘at present, to introduce any alteration in the measures and weights which are now used in the United States.’ (2) In 1796, the House passed ‘An act directing certain experiments to be made to ascertain uniform standards of weights and measures for the United States,’ but the bill was never taken up by the Senate.”
Applying a higher or lower price for what something is actually worth is the definition of unjust weights and balances. Today we see the greed of men manifested when they overcharge or gouge their neighbor by charging more than what is just for a service or product.
Gouging is sin, it’s a form of not loving your neighbor, it’s taking advantage of your neighbor, your fellow man.
“Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.” Matthew 7:12
“Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.” Matthew 22:39
“Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.” Romans 13:10
A friend of mine told me: “Those in business today who gouge people by overcharging them do it because no one stands up and holds them accountable.” In other words, as long as they can get away with it, they will do it.
He is correct. As I think back, there one particular example that comes to mind of recent, where in my estimation, I was the victim of gouging, of unjust weights and balances.
$22 for a plate lunch, a to-go lunch which was not a large volume of food and no drink was included (which I personally never get anyway) and they didn’t even have empty cups or water available.
These gougers have all kinds of ways, sayings, they use to “justify” their charges, such as “it’s industry standard pricing,” or “standard price charged by everyone in our industry.” etc.
After being gouged, I contacted them, their leadership, and sought to reason. Neither budged and so I exposed them with one star reviews and an explanation as to why I viewed their charges as gouging, as an unjust weight and balance.
“Just balances, just weights… shall ye have.” Leviticus 19:36
“A false balance is abomination to the LORD: but a just weight is his delight.” Proverbs 11:1
We usually quote the first part of this verse and apply it to spiritual balance, which is fitting and true. Yet the application of this statement involves charging our neighbor equitably for goods and services.
Isn’t it best to charge fairly and sleep well?
Stealing from others, gouging, unjustly greedily overcharging others, brings curses which includes not being able to sleep soundly. Listen to the wisdom of our God in Solomon:
“The sleep of a labouring man is sweet, whether he eat little or much: but the abundance of the rich will not suffer him to sleep. 13 There is a sore evil which I have seen under the sun, namely, riches kept for the owners thereof to their hurt. 14 But those riches perish by evil travail: and he begetteth a son, and there is nothing in his hand. 15 As he came forth of his mother’s womb, naked shall he return to go as he came, and shall take nothing of his labour, which he may carry away in his hand. 16 And this also is a sore evil, that in all points as he came, so shall he go: and what profit hath he that hath laboured for the wind?” Ecclesiastes 5:12-16
Covetousness and greed run rampant among fallen men and yet greed and covetousness will reap the just reward of eternal damnation.
“For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. 6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. 7 Be not ye therefore partakers with them.” Ephesians 5:5-7
“Thou shalt not steal.” Exodus 20:15
Overcharging another, gouging, is stealing. Any person who is perpetrating thievery on others, and this includes overcharging/gouging, is ungodly and cannot sleep well. Such is an unrepentant sinner. Is it really worth and unclean conscience? Is it worth spending eternity in hell? Though completely ignored by the professing apostate church world today, all sin must be cut off from our lives, must be crucified (Mark 9:43-49).
“Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. 35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s, the same shall save it. 36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?” Mark 8:36-37
“Just balances, just weights, a just ephah, and a just hin, shall ye have: I am the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt.” Leviticus 19:36
“A just weight and balance are the LORD’S: all the weights of the bag are his work.” Proverbs 16:11
“But thou shalt have a perfect and just weight, a perfect and just measure shalt thou have: that thy days may be lengthened in the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.” Deuteronomy 25:15
PRAYER: Father You are holy. Please forgive any greed in my heart. Please, from this moment forward, bring deep conviction of sin to my conscience LORD. Break me to the core of my being and grant that all stony places in my heart be replaced with an heart of flesh. Please unite my heart to fear Thy name dear LORD. In Jesus’ Name, amen.
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Articles
Faith in Resurrection [podcast]
When we die downward and are dead and buried with Christ, we can be assured that God is going to raise us upward.
“But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.” Romans 8:11
Romans 6:1-14
“1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed (brought to naught, nullified), that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.”
The Crucified Life | Travis Bryan III
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The Chosen are being Called and Prepared to “Go” [podcast]
“A Just Weight is His Delight” and Gouging is Sin
Faith in Resurrection [podcast]
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The Chosen are being Called and Prepared to “Go” [podcast]
“A Just Weight is His Delight” and Gouging is Sin
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